They wont pay….is that the Pinoy way!!!!
Its not that often that I have to have a moan about things in this country but recently I have been bombarded by so many examples of the lack of “trust” in people agreeing to pay what they owe, even if its totally clear .
One of my friends recently as given a job for two months on a weekly pay as a waiter. Remember he has NO money and this job allowed him to eat!!
After four weeks of working he was not paid and despite asking he was given many false promises of payments and many excuses. After asking for the eighth time he was asked to leave and he would be paid later that week. He never was!! Have you seen a man cry out of frustration and hurt, no money , no food?
This was a large national organisation here in the Philippines, and after SEVEN weeks still no payment at all, but many more promises. He was so desperate, and yet so polite to these people I asked if I could help?
He very reluctantly agreed and I made one very polite but VERY FIRM call and within five hours they made a payment , as I told them I would sit in the restaurant tonight and have a strong conversation with them until they paid, even if it was all night and even if customers overheard. They paid for sure but are still holding a deposit of p500!!!
I have from time to time been begged by friends here to assist with financial hardships and most times I say no ,but I will assist with things that can make a long term difference like schooling or job help and advice, but sometimes when you see tears running down the face you give in and pay with their solemn promise of getting your money back. Needless to say you very rarely do and these people disappear.
Over the last few weeks I have been assisting a company here in Davao with small consultation work and several times the money does not get paid or the person in charge does not turn up for an appointment. Yesterday after waiting y two weeks for the overdue payment I returned to the office at an agreed time to discuss the plans and get the outstanding payments.
You guessed yet again NO SHOW , no answer to e mails no answer to text and no answer to missed calls.
The thing that is becoming very apparent is that this is not just a problem for the ex pat, its ingrained into life here and thus employees are treated bad and they then have contempt for the employer. The circle continues, and continues to the point it is sometimes expected that you will not get a payment based on a promise, so the payment is taken in other means from an employer…THEFT.
OK the money I do not get paid is a big inconvenience, the money the locals do not get paid is life threatening and in most cases the “law” is too slow or too hard to action i order to get the money. Come on poor or rich a promise is a promise!!!
How rotten that income sources in the Philippines can be so unstable, no matter if they are from big, multi-million peso companies or from small and medium firms. I have had my own share of not being paid; of course as a freelance worker I cannot possibly make an official complaint to the Department of Labor or any of the courts.
That said, even if one was properly employed (with contracts and all), sometimes payment doesn’t come as guaranteed, or as scheduled. And like what happened to your friend, there isn’t much the employee can do. The people who owe money will come up with plenty of excuses and then may even hold back an amount of money that isn’t supposed to be held back.
It’s nasty and unprofessional and I sincerely hope that private and public authorities alike would be able to come up with a solution to promote in the workplace more ethical ways of fulfilling financial obligations. Many countries have long outgrown IOUs but it seems that the Philippines isn’t one of them.
Hi John, to answer your question: unfortunately YES, many many times YES…
John
i have seen examples of this too, it is a case of taking advantage of the respect that Filipinos have for their big brothers or sisters, ok they are companies not individuals but the principle is the same.
it does not square at all with the western views as your examples have shown. This is one aspect of a (i would say) a slightly darker side to the way things operate over here, it is not right, and Klaus says it above
John,
I am very lucky. As you know, I have recently gotten a job with an full service Architectural and Engineering firm. Even though the pay is “Filipino” wages, there is talk that my position and pay will encrease.
The other day was payday. The accounting girl told me even if you need to leave early, they pay for 8 hours. They even pay premium overtime pay. They paid me for a full day for the day I was interviewed and also one other day I stopped by to show them how I use the software differently than they do.
The owner is going to send some of the Engineers to Manila to UP to get their masters degree and is even going to buy a house in Manila so they will have a decent place to live.
With all the horror stories I have heard about employeers here in the Philippines, this firm is a wonderful company.
This is the same sort of thing that happened in the U.S. before Labor Unions were allowed to organize the workers and put pressure on companies that used unfair labor practices. I am not a fan of unions and I think in many cases they have outlived their usefulness, but this may be what is needed in this case.
Of course the government could prevent the need for the unions if they created and enforced labor laws.
Bruce- congratulations on your job. It sounds great.
My two cents:
I don’t think this is only true with Pinoy’s. This is also very true here in the West…only it’s done in a very sophisticated way….with esoteric terms like retrenchment, bankruptcy, foreclosure, etc.
With money you either give it away and say goodbye to it ( I aqree with AmericanLola on this) or get a good collateral that is more valuable than the amount to lend. This is why pawnshopping is a huge business in the Philippines.
If you go furtherto the next level the lender should investigate the borrower’s potential to pay later. This is how the banks do it….or used to do it. You let down your guard and you have ’subprime’ lending. The borrower will just walk away. The borrower knew all along he can’t afford that house but some some Dutch or French town was trusting their money to UBS or Bank Paribas to lend to the borrower the towns’ money with the borrower’s cooked up/shoddy credit credential.
Everybody suffers. Nobody trusts anybody. The lender won’t lend anymore and a legitimate borrower can’t convince the lender to let go of his money—that’s credit crunch.
My point is when it comes to money the Ronald Reagan’s cold war principle holds: Trust but verified. This is true with small change or with trillions of dollars.
The same principle holds true with employment I think.
Yes, John that is really a sad story and not an uncommon one. Even the government offices do not pay their employees when they should. Many teachers live on borrowed money for months because they have not been given their salary. As soon as they are paid, they are right back to zero after paying their debts. Pretty hard to encourage people in debt free living when they work and don’t get paid.
Jobs are so scarce and hard to get that employers can, and often do, whatever they want; hire people they never intend to pay, pay whenever they feel like it, fire people after 5 months and hire a new group to avoid paying full-time benefits, give overtime with little or no extra pay. House helpers are probably among the most abused when it comes to pay and hours of work. I knew one woman whose father owed a rich woman money and so she worked as a slave for years to ‘pay it off.’
Frankly, I get really mad when I hear people saying Filipinos are just lazy and need to work. How?! When?! Where will they work?! And if they work, will they be paid? No wonder so many Filipinos go abroad. In the places where they are not abused, they are esteemed for their hard work and cheerful attitude. And who wouldn’t be happy to be getting paid for a job well done?
On the other hand, people are often hired for the wrong reasons (someone’s sister, or cousin, or godchild, etc.) and do not earn what they make. There are terrible employees who are almost impossible to fire, once they pass a certain time there. They can steal, stir up trouble and be completely incompetent, and yet there they remain, year after year. My observation is that many of these work in government offices. Ahem.
Hi John
Yes, I learnt the same lesson the hard way in The Phills. “Can I borrow”, means “will you give me”, coz you will never see the money back so don`t expect it. When someone asks to borrow money, I just “give” them a smaller amount, that way, we can both sleep at night and I don`t lose a friend or relation!
Keep up the good work John
Malcolm
I wrote an article related to this kind of stuff. Here it is:
http://www.carlosonweb.com/articles/2008/03/23/wheres-the-money-part-2/
And I don’t think the problem is exclusively found in the Philippines. It has a global scale, as long as someone ‘wants’ to be exploited, there will always be another one who exploits.
Hi John,
Sad, but true. But there are still a few Filipinos that have a decency to keep their Word – usually learned from their associations with foreigners. The rule of thumb is to give a little and expect gratitude through their service. Anything you loan is a gift and if they pay you back its a bonus.
Great post!
Sometimes I think the locals shoot themselves too. I had a good friend here who I helped get a job and get out of debt and gave him a start in the career path. Recently he decided to quit a good job came back to me for financial help. When I said “NO” he stole from me instead.
Marcelina I agree with you.
John,
@ John … Thanks for posting this. It needs to be brought out into the open for discussion. It’s a frequent problem, and one foreigners in particular should be well aware of. I intend to live here for some time. Yet if my circumstances were changed so that I had to take a Philippines-based job I believe I would leave for home the next day. As American Lola pointed out, even people in coveted government jobs don’t get paid on time … or are required to pay back salary under the table … the main reason public schools are in such a deplorable state.
@ Mark C .. I share many of your views regarding unions … I’m even probably more pro union than many US men my age … I watched my son get tricked and cheated for thr first 10 years of work until he got union work. The Philippines has many unions. They do not seem to be the answer here though. The government also has stringent employment laws, much more “liberal” to the worker than in many US states … but as Am Lola pointed out, getting a government office to take action on the law is ever so much different than the law being on the books.
@ Malcom. Indeed my thoughts. I no longer ‘lend’ money to anyone. If I perceive their need is real, I will ‘gift’ them something to tide them over. If they ask about repayment, I tell them their obligation is to help someone else. Many times the money isn’t even used for the original purpose. If it were a loan I would be livid. If it’s a gift, it’s theirs to use as they see fit and that’s the end of it.
For guys and gals who keep asking about coming here and seeking employment? I would advise that you rethink your plan … in general, especially for a foreigner, it will not work … but God bless and best of luck whatever you decide
well put, american lola. i couldn’t have said it better.
Article is so true. I had a friend who didnt get paid for 5 weeks and eventually after deciding to leave they paid her 1/2 her owed salary to stay.. Anywhere else in the world there is more likely another outcome than a thank you and back to work..
Regarding working as a foreigner in RP I think you have to look at making your own income from outside and try to be self-sufficent within the Philippines. Im currently in the process of setting up a piggery with my wife and a few houses to rent out. Long term this will expand into Goats, ducks, catfish and maybe a few paddy fields. But its more to do with being self-sufficent than trying to make a “western” salary which is unrealistic.
I dont think the Philippines is in for a change any time soon because quite simply people put up with it. Its very difficult to change things when people dont fight for rights.
Loans.. Ive had to dish a few out but thats why a cooker sits in my house. I would never give out a loan without taking something in return as a deposit. BUT I do prefer putting people to work for a day or a week rather than giving out hand outs..
that way if they need the money so bad they have earned it and I get some repairs done.. both parties are happy and no debt for the person needing the money.