Smoke ‘em if you got ‘em
This phrase has been heard by countless GIs over the years. I can almost hear some of the comments coming as I type this article. In recent times, in most of North America, Europe, and Australia, smoking has become taboo, with smokers being regarded as somewhat akin to lepers… EGADS! How dare you poison MY air!?!?!?!? (I’m self-censoring my response, but I think you can hazard a pretty good guess.)
Yes, I too am one of those who smokes the noxious weed. I’m normally reasonably considerate about it… If I am somewhere where smoking is permitted and someone nicely asks me to put it out, I generally do so. I have been highly successful at quitting… I’ve quit dozens of times. Oh, you mean that it is results that count? Well, not so successful.
For those considering moving to the Philippines who are bothered by smoke, you should be prepared to face a lot more smokers here than in the Western world… Welcome to Asia. You also generally will not find much sympathy among the general populace, so, if smoke really bothers you, you need to adjust… It is highly unlikely that the 35 million Filipino smokers will change their habits just to suit you.
Officially, around 35% of Filipinos smoke. Unofficially, just travelling around here, that percentage is too low. Officially, in Manila, it is illegal to smoke indoors in enclosed public spaces, and that law is generally followed, observed, and abided by in shopping malls and movie theatres and the like. However, open-air restaurants and most bars that serve primarily liquor are exempt. Additionally, some places, like airports, generally have enclosed smoking bars on the premises. The Philippines is gradually becoming more smoke-free, and, honestly, even as a smoker, I tend to agree with most of the prohibitions, especially in enclosed restaurants.
However, if you want to be a scofflaw (and not a very good guest in the country, by the way), most smoking fines are under 1,000 pesos, which is easily affordable for most foreigners. In any event, you will encounter many, many smokers here, most of whom start at a young age (as most smokers do nearly everywhere). Cigarettes are among the cheapest in the entire world here, with a standard pack of 20 costing anywhere from 20 pesos (40 cents US) for really awful locally made sticks, to 35 pesos (sometimes cheaper) (80 cents US) for Philippine-manufactured Marlboros, to 70 pesos for imported brands, to 80 pesos at the airport. Most sari sari stores will also sell cigarettes by the stick, or in small packs of 5 or 10. In fact, the only places I know of where cigarettes are cheaper is Russia and Indonesia. Contrast this with an average $5 to $7 per pack in the States or a whopping 5.75 pounds per pack in the UK, or nearly 15Euros in Scandinavia.
This isn’t saying that the Philippine government is pro-smoking. In fact, quite the contrary. The smoking laws are being broadened, advertising prohibited in many places, and a law has been proposed to start putting the same horrid pictures on cigarette packs that you see in Thailand, Hong Kong, and Singapore, among other places. However, with such a large percentage of the population being smokers, combined with general Filipino “live and let live” attitudes, militant anti-smokers will have problems here… That statement is virtually guaranteed.
I was not born under a rock. I know all of the health risks. I do not smoke anywhere near my son. I am generally a considerate smoker out in public. However, If this article seems a bit sarcastic, it is because, quite frankly, I get fed-up with the “holier than thou” attitudes of the smoking Nazis in the United States, and especially the UK. These are normally the same people who drive everywhere they go, putting far more pollutants in the air than my cigarette.
So, for all the smokers who read this, here’s my list of airports that I know of where you can still smoke after security, followed by a hint for airports like JFK and LHR where it is forbidden (Scoff away, Law!)
Asia: MNL, CEB, TPE, KHH, ICN, PUS, NRT, KIX, FUK, PVG, CAN, HKG, SGN, HAN, BKK, MHF, BWN, KUL, SIN, CDG, SUB, MYY, BOM, DEL, ISB, KHI, DUB, MCT, SHJ, AUH, BAH, DOH, KWI, RUH, AMM. (Not allowed… Istanbul, and Beijing, unless they changed back this year)
Australia and NZ: None
Europe: HAM, ZRH, GVA, FCO, FRA, MUC, MAD
USA: MIA, IAD, SDF, STL, DFW (American Lounge only), TPA, RDU, SJU (They closed the areas in Las Vegas).
South America: Every airport I’ve ever been to there allows smoking, except in Brazil.
Stuck wrong side off passport control on a long transit and jonesing for a nicotine fix? Handicapped toilets make a convenient place to grab a quick smoke, since the doors generally lock (Don’t try this at LGW… they are alarmed there). Also, another alternative is to stock up on dip or chew and grab a Styrofoam cup (Both of which are NOT common in Asia, so if you chew and are moving or traveling here, better stock up at duty free or search online for a tobacconist). That also works for most airplanes except those owned by Delta (Where they prohibit it for some reason.)
You know all the health risks and you continue this despicable, deadly habit? Am I’m a “smoking nazi” because I care about my health and don’t want to die? These are the facts: smoking cigarettes will destroy your health and kill you in the most painful, degrading way. Before it does, it will make you look older, smell bad, and cost many pesos, dollars, pounds, etc. to you and everyone. We ALL pay for the medical costs associated with this poison.
I’m very surprised to see an article like this in 2009; promoting “smoker-friendly” airports. This is the exact opposite message that should be conveyed. Stop smoking! You’re killing yourself and (more importantly) innocent others.
Mike: In 2009 there are still millions of smokers in Asia…Like it or not, those are the facts. Additionally, in the Philippines, you pay your own medical. My smoking is not costing you a single Peso. How does one enclosed smoking room in a 1,000,000 sqf airport impact you in the slightest? Have you visited Manila, or even LAX? I would be willing to bet you that you inhale more pollutants just standing on the curb than from the enclosed smoking room.
This whole issue has become entirely political in the West, backed by dubious science and easy political gain. If it is so offensive, then simply ban cigarrettes. Oh…. You mean the politicians don’t want to lose the TAX money we pay on every single stick?
Yes, I’ve visited Manila and the pollution is terrible; by far the worst I’ve experienced. I understand your point, but when you refer to decades of the most extensive and intensive scientific and medical research ever done as “dubious science”…well, I can’t argue with that logic.
BTW, I echo what Edward said about you quitting. One less is a drop in the ocean but it is one less. And the oceans are getting smaller. Good luck.
Hey John,
Years ago I read an article in Reason Magazine about a study from the Harvard School of Medicine. It stated that the effects from second hand smoke was negigable. You would have to be stuck in a non-ventilated bathroom for months with a smoker to have an effect.
It reminds me of the Alar apple scare years ago. Someone would have to eat a busshel of apples a day to have an effect.
Im not advocating forcing others to breath in second hand smoke, Its just that some things have been blown way out of proportion. I was reading an article the other day where some condo owners were suing because they smelled a smoker.
I dont smoke, but if somebody wants to abuse their own lungs, let ‘em. If I dont like the smoke I move away.
Hudson: Unfortunately, your reasoned argument is usually drowned out by all of the noise. I’ve read the same studies, and that is precisely the point of the article. I am not advocating smoking, by any means. I wish I had never started. However, it is a fact that expats who move here, who do not smoke, should be prepared to face a much more “smoker friendly” environment.
My exact thoughts John. Chi-Town is a very unforgiving place to smoke. If the fumes won’t kill you, the price of ciggies will w/c cost abt $9/each. Too many restrictions too. One can only smoke 9 ft away fr the building front door. Or smoke in another street if you’re around a hospital. The cold weather the stench of the smoke sticking to ur hands & coat, I have seriously tried. But definitely, these conditions curbed my smoking. In Spain, I might not e considered a smoker.
Roy: When I lived there, there were still smoking bars and so on. I’m certain that the Division Street crowd didn’t like the ban too much. Chicago is another place where things have gotten silly… Didn’t they ban fois gras, too? I think that generated so much publicity that they eventually relented. In fact, from a pretty much ignored restaurant ingredient, all of a sudden everyone wanted to try it!
When you say “killing innocent others” I assume you’re talking about that tired old saw concerning the “dangers of second-hand smoke.” Do a little research; it was junk science.
Yes, smoking cigarettes can shorten one’s life. But it’s THEIR life. I personally dislike the smell of cigarettes, but I do enjoy a cigar. I have a right to my pleasure, and cigarette smokers have a right to theirs.
And to answer your question: no, caring about your health and not wanting to die does not make you a smoke nazi. On the other hand, using brown-shirt tactics to force your views on others does make you a bit of a nazi.
KanoDoug: You get the point!
(shaking my head) HaHa geeeeezus John so your the SOB that has been stinking up the toilet
John I smoked for 32 years, I quit for the last time in 2005 after a stint in the hospital that my doctor said I had COPD, in reality I didn’t but he scared me enough into quitting, I watched my father die from lung cancer he smoked for 40 years but who knows where that lung cancer came from. I feel liberated now that i quit i really hated the smell and the habit, My house is a no smoking zone as my father in law and some of my wife’s brothers also smoke but s you say it is a “taboo” that we are all getting an education about I mean all those surgeon warnings can’t all be wrong – can they ?
Tommy: Really, I’m glad you were able to quit. In most European airports, even the regular toilets have become “smoking rooms”… The bans are not really enforced in certain places, especially France and Italy. Seriously, I’ve tried to quit… The low price and high prevalence of smokers here makes it really, really difficult.
It it the hypocrisy of the whole subject that irks me. As I mentioned above… Either ban them or take our sin taxes and shut up about it.
I was born in 1945. Had my first “smoke” in 1950. I was smoking a pack a day by 7th grade. I quit in 1991. Cold turkey and man it was hard. Your trouble John is the cigarettes made in the USA are not the same ones you buy there. The tar is double and the nicatine must be 3 times the US. They market to the kids in Asia. China and the Philippines are the big markets for them. So John, smoke them while you can. I have known people light up right after they lose a lung. The habit is that strong. Good luck on your next try to quit. Maybe you make that time.
Edward: It is a stronger habit than perhaps anything else. I agree with you as to the marketing to kids…
I remember the former Surgeon General of the U. S. state that cigarette addiction was far more powerful and more difficult to break than any other drug, including the opioids (heroin). Those that have never smoked, or have never had any strong addiction to anything just cannot possibly understand.
Spencer: Something that a nonsmoker will never understand.
Everyone has a right to smoke I suppose. And appreicate you not blowing it on me. I use to smoke them and then went to smokeless tobacco. Found out my 40 year old friend who is still in the Army was diagnosed with mouth cancer the other day. Am getting older and relize that life is but a vapor. Stood with a man and watched him die with lung cancer. Of course he was older. In the U.S. there is a downplay on tobacco and a up lifting on alcohol. They should put the warning on alchohol. Know alot of broken homes because of booze. Been there seen it all. Alot of people say eat, drink and be merry. If tobacco was banned people would raise it. Some people are just to hooked to quit. My dad had heart surgery and still would not quit smoking. Maybe he would have lived a few more years if he had not. Edward that is some wise advise on smoking. Sometime you younger guys can learn from us older guys. “Smoke em if you got um”. Thats what they use to say in the A.F. when I was stationed at Clark. Remember when they put sample packs of cigarettes in our rations. Now you can hardly find a place to smoke on a Air Force Base. Is a proven fact that people who do not smoke tend to live longer. To each his own I guess. Heard a old saying once. “Fire on one end and a sucker on the other”! HA HA LOL1
Bob: How strong an addiction? Well, I can tell you that I was reading the memoir of an American POW who survived the Bataan Death March. The survivors were primarily the nonsmokers, who traded their rations for cigarettes.
So you think that cigarettes are good for you. Go ahead and think that don’t matter to me. I used to make the same excuses. But then its your choice. Know I feel better by not smoking or using any tobacco. My food even taste better. I used to dip and believe me when I quite tobacco I literally shook. The best thing I have ever done is to quit nicotine. Found a old farm book where it tells you how to mix nicotine to kill insects. Nope nicotine is not good. Of course neither is too much achohol. I am 62 and am glad to still be here. Can run a mile nonstop. Know one thing cigarettes stink. Been there and used all kinds of tobacci and am glad I am free from the poisen Nicotine. The air is good! Alot of people do as I did and quit cigarettes for smokeless tobacco. Just found out from one of my friends who did’nt quit the smokeless tobacco that he now at 40 has mouth cancer. Guess a person can get it on the mouth or in the lungs. Of course you are right we could die of indigestion too I suppose. Have a good un men!
Bob: I never stated that cigarettes were good for you or healthy.
Interesting point John…yep, I’m still a smoker too (though I do try to limit it to less than a pack a day)…and yep, like you, I’ve quit dozens of times as well. Tough addiction to break. But you are right about the anti-smoking Nazis too. There is certainly a political aspect to it in the west. When I was in the Phils last summer, I was blown away at the prices…a fraction of the US cost.
It’s a choice and I think you are right about the live-and-let-live aspect of the Philippines. They are really more tolerant of personal choices like that…as long as it does nobody else any harm.
Personally, I’ll probably give it up soon…I’m still a bachelor for a few more months, but I’m sure my bride-to-be would prefer it. However, it should be my choice. The simple fact is, in the west, it’s now fast food and alcohol that are coming under the gun…just like tobacco was 20 years ago…for the same reasons and in the same way…because it’s not good for you and costs money…and my response is the same…butt out!
I hope some thread of libertarianism stays alive in Asia (esp. the Philippines). It’s one aspect of my visit there that I love.
RC: I will probably try again too… I don’t want my son to pick up the habit, and he tends to mimic me. You and I are in total agreement about the rest… My problem is with those in the West who think that the rest of the world needs to conform to their values.
John I am a non-smoker but I totally respect the right of others to smoke. Its really none of my business if you or anyone chose to smoke. I wonder how many people that are so quick to condemn a smoker to an early death have other vices. Drinking, unsafe sex, not wearing a seat belt, crossing the street without a permission light,going on a boat without a life vest,eating too large a meal, having a cracker with trans fat, eating fast food, drinking water from a plastic bottle,eating a salad with ranch dressing,etc, etc…. I think you get my point. We all have choices to make and there are times when we just chose to live our lives as we see fit. I personally like it when others let me chose how I live whatever days I have in my own particular fashion. So after all that John “smoke em if you got em”. Ron
Ron: Exactly my point!
hi john,
Just like you, I am a smoker too ’till this day, I agree to most of what you said, people has a choice, well I know i could get a lung cancer from smoking and perhaps i can get it too in someways even if i don’t smoke, most study that I’ve read about smoking is that it reduced your life to at least 3~5 years of your actual life time, the average life span of Filipinos is about 70 years old, my father died when he was 60, he died of lung cancer BUT not from smoking, he died from the fumes of welding works. If my life time will last for 70 years without smoking and if i die at 65 with smoking, I’d choose to smoke, at least I experienced it and enjoyed it, don’t get me wrong I am not suggesting that people should smoke. many people die at early age not because they smoke? but they just eat?, many foods nowadays can kill you when you hit 40, particularly the fast foods, it seems that foods nowadays can kill faster than being a smoker.
Dans: Certainly. Don’t get me wrong… the purpose of this article was not to advocate smoking. I really wish I never picked up the habit. However, I certainly don’t like the stupidity I see going on in the States and other places. You would think that you were putting a gun to some peoples’ heads every time you light up, given the reactions I’ve seen.
I agree people have the right to smoke if they so desire, as long as they don’t do it around me. If I start to urinate on someones leg, should I expect them to ask me “nicely” to stop?
Interesting that the author of the article didn’t choose to reply to this comment…the whole issue is 2 words that haven’t been mentioned 1 time in all this – secondhand smoke. If the author or anyone wants to smoke and kill him/herself, no one would argue they have the right. More power. But you do not have the right to kill me or even threaten my health.
According to the National Cancer Institute, secondhand smoke causes approximately 3,000 lung cancer deaths to non-smokers in the US alone. That excludes all other cancers, emphysema, heart disease, and other smoking-related diseases.
Mike: First off, this comment was posted after 11:00 PM Philippine time… I don’t tend to review comments in the middle of the night. Secondly, as I mentioned above, the whole secondhand smoke research has become political, and therefore highly dubious. I refer back to my comment about how an enclosed, negative pressure smoking room in a 1mm sq ft airport impacts you in the least.
The whole secondhand smoke research has become political and dubious? That’s one of the most asinine things I’ve ever heard. Man, you are in the clouds, are you sure that’s tobacco you’re sucking into your one and only body? Those Filipine cigarettes must be awfully strong.
Smokers like you have no respect for their own health so of course you have no respect for anyone else’s.
John,
I believe everyone has a right to kill themselves, but I also believe that you should not take me with you. If I go to bar, restaurant or house which is full of smoke I will have a head ache the next day, not from the alcohol but the effects of breathing the smoke. I will also have allergy symptoms for a few days afterward so I tend to believe that second hand smoke does hurt. I know the pollution in the air can be just as bad or worse. The first time I went to the Philippines I suffered from severe allergies for a number of days and the air smelled like gasoline to me. I do not allow indoor smoking at my house, primarily because smoking and drinking usually ends up with burns in the furniture and I just hate the smell anyway. I think the airports are great for providing a location for smokers. So Smoke’um if you have’em, just not in my presence and please don’t through your butts in my yard.
Steve: If smoking is permitted somewhere, then how would I know it bothered you unless I am asked to stop… I can tell you, though, that in most of Asia, smoking is permitted in a lot more places.
John,
As I said previously, I support a persons right to smoke as long as they are not around me. Yes, I know smoking in Asia is still very prevalent. I’m just glad of the smoking laws in Davao. To me common courtesy is this: Are my actions going to affect anyone around me? Should I wait for my neighbor to come next door at 2am to tell me my stereo is to loud? Why is it not the smokers responsibility to ask “do you mind if I smoke?”. I don’t think the mindset of everyone doing what they want knowing it affects others around them unless someone complains really adds to society.
Steve: Not meaning to be argumentative, but in bars and other places where people commonly smoke, shouldn’t you be the one to expect smoke in those places?
John,
I don’t mind if anyone smokes in a bar, as I don’t go to bars. The smoking I refer to is in restaurants, public transportation, in the mall, or any other place non-smokers frequent. If I encounter someone in the CR is it ok to urinate on their leg? Shouldn’t they have that expectation since they are going to the CR?
Richard: I sympathize, but as you found out, smoking in the Philippines is quite prevalent. As to private property, I would never even think about lighting up in someone’s house without asking first, and I wouldn’t even think of asking unless I saw others smoking inside. That is just good manners.
Steve: In most of the Philippines, malls, public transport, and enclosed, air conditioned restaurants are already nonsmoking zones. Most people here seem to abide by those restrictions already.
Good one John, good one indeed. You covered a lot of ground here, and not only about smoking.
I’m currently in one of my non-smoking interludes (my life has been full of them) but when I see comments proposing to tell me, or you, or anyone else what to do it makes me want to walk right around the corner to the sari-sari store and pickup up a pack of Winsotn Lights (for 30 pesos) before I even finish commenting. One thing I like about living in the Philippines is “to each his own”, there are so many fewer ‘you do this because I say so” folks here that I enjoy it, smoking or not.
Regarding the “smokable” airports, two that I didn’t see on the list were DVO (Davao City … there’s a smoking lounge to the left on the gate concourse) and MFM (Macau .. open air smoking areas at each end of their main concourse, with those Japanese “Smoking Clean” air vacuum machines. (by the way, anyone going to Hong Kong from up here in Luzon should definitely consider flying out to Clark to Macau .. typicaly the fare is half or less the HGK fare and when you land in Macau you can get right on the hydrofoil ferry in be in Central, Hong Kong quicker than you can normally get there from the Hong Kong airport. A really nice place, Macau.
Dave: Thanks… You and I seem to think a lot alike many times (I miss your articles here, BTW, but still take a look at your blog, too.)
I haven’t flown into Davao, but I understand there is a really nice, new airport there. As to Macao (Forgot that one!), you are spot on… Very modern, clean, and nearly zero hassle factor. There is also decent Macanese food at the restaurant if you are stuck there (LOVE those egg tarts, especially when they are warm!)
30 yrs ago my wife says ” it is smokey in here” So I rolled the window down. She says “It is getting cold in here” So I rolled the window up. “she says it is getting smokey in here”. So I pulled over got out & finished me smoke. We are not going to win this one John. Although I am much more considerate of others now, & am making a great effort to quit. In the mean time I too wish those puritans would ” Shut Up”
Guy: Seems I’ve had that conversation, too. Rebecca was in the Middle East so long, it doesn’t seem to bother her. She’ll even occasionally take one of mine if she has a case of nerves (She’s a nonsmoker, but seems to be able to smoke one and not become addicted). I’m gonna try again to quit, though.
I am a friend of a nurse from Abulug. She told me that even already she was a nurse she used to bring pasalubong of cigarettes for her bros who smoked but then she realized the tragic cost of smoking. I seem to have this impression that there are more smokers in the north.
Roy: Not sure about that… I’ve seen plenty of smokers in the Visayas and Mindanao. I can say that nearly everyone in Becky’s family, except her and her sister-in-law, are smokers.
John,
FYI. I used to smoke a pack a day for 20 years. Tried to quit many times without success. I tried gum, patches, hypnosis, cold turkey. Nothing worked until my doctor gave me a script for Wellbutrin. It blocks the pleasure sensors in the brain. After a couple of weeks you realize that your just not getting any pleasure from that smoke. You put it out half way through. Then, a week after that, just a puff or two and your done. After a month I just didnt want ‘em anymore.
Just a suggestion. I wish you success.
Hudson: I actually quit for about a year and a half with Wellbutrin (With some really nasty side effects… Worse than nicotine withdrawal). I thought about trying it here, but I’m really not certain about availability, though. It is an antidepressant, and those tend to not be too common here.
I was a smoker, but the UK put so much tax on cigarettes I decided my priority was the beer. I have some friends in UK who smoke, but they feel they have to hide it now as the non smoking attitude is in the British system.
A new law now stops smoking in Pubs too.
As a non smoker I like it, but I also agree its gone too far and the nanny state has become to over powering.
John: The UK has really become the most restrictive, in my opinion, even more so than Singapore. However, I’ve always been a believer in letting the free market decide… If there was such a large demand for nonsmoking pubs, then someone would have opened one.
A very good friend of mine owns a factory in France. When the smoking ban in the workplace was announced, he tossed me a copy of LeMatin,about 2 days before the ban, with his picture on the front page, ripping into the new law. (His factory included a very noxious smelter, which is nearly impossible to control, and around 90% of his employees smoked). He said, “Jean… Liberte, Fraternite, Egalite my *ss. I OWN this building and they will tell me what to do?” I said, “Paul, I agree, but now that you are public, who do you think the first place the inspectors will visit on Friday will be?” Of course, on Friday morning, they were at the factory gates at 9:00AM sharp. Fined him 5,000 Euros. So, he hired security guards with radios whose sole job was to watch for smoking inspectors. This went on for about 3 months until his lawyer found a loophole that allowed him to build a negative pressure smoking room. It was entirely the principle of it all. He really couldn’t care less about having to step outside for a smoke.
What kind of nasty sise effects John? I have a perscription already.
Guy: Because they work on your nervous system, it was, in effect, a type of migraine that mimicked a heart attack. Severe headache, nausea, and the entire left side of my body going numb and feeling like bugs crawling up and down my arms. Happened about 4 days into taking the pills, and lasted for 4 days. Went to the hospital and they said that Wellbutrin can cause these effects in some people. Take the pills, but if you feel “funny”, then go to the doctor immediately.
Hi John, I agree with John Grant. Beer is more important than smoking. I quit about 15 years ago. I don’t really care if others light up near me – I sorta like to inhale a bit to remind me of how nice it was and best of all it doesn’t cost me a penny!
I was reading another blog http://www.wanderingblindly.com/2009/09/legal-sanity-maintenance.html and this guy has another method for smoking. You might want to check into it. Sounds and looks a bit weird, but maybe it works. Called BluCigs.
John: Heard about those, but never seen them… I may give them a try. On an airplane worries me a bit, as the guy mentioned in his blog.
Hi John,
I quit smoking only 31 years, 10 months and 3 days ago as of today, A bit like John Grant I quit because on Army pay in England I could not afford a car, Drink Beer and smoke also so I went Cold Turkey and quit the smokes, the Car and the Beer Stayed! Just 7 days later my Father Died and not smoking over that period really made me stop for good!
I do not mind people smoking, even in my Hotel I have no restrictions on smoking and I sell Smokes also and if anyone is smoking a Cigar I will sit next to them as there is nothing better than the smell of a good Cigar, Well some things are better!
Years ago when I used to fly a lot I always picked the Smoking Section on the plane for the simple reason that kids were nearly always in None Smoking and could not disturb me!
If people want to smoke then its their choice and not the busiess of anyone else in my humble opinion!
Chris: Don’t celebrate too soon… I’ve heard that our favorite Nanny State is considering heavy taxation of beer in the off-licences…. In order to protect the pubs whose business has been mysteriously dropping the last few years.
I dont think it should be a mystery that the Pub business has been dropping in recent years, I am sure the smoking ban had something to do with it just as it has in many parts of the USA. The last time I was in the UK, even before the nationwide smoking ban in public plcaes ( including Pubs ) there were a few non-smoking pubs in London that seemed to be doing a booming business.
I think it should have been left up to the individual Pub / Bar owners to decide to have a smoking or non-smoking establishment. They know what is best for their own business and regular clientel.
New York State banned smoking in the bars a few years ago but it seems interesting that in New York City there are a very few, very posh , high class ” Cigar Bars ” where I believe many politicians hang out in , smoking is still permitted there ! Like who are they trying to fool ?
Bob: Yep… The nonsmoking pubs were doing good business before, as were some of the smoking pubs near them. The concept of private property has been supplanted by the idea that everyone should be able to go anywhere they choose and not be bothered by anything, property rights be damned.
Washington state is one of the worst when it comes to smoking. High taxes, can’t smoke in public, etc.
My Dear Husband doesn’t smoke cigarette but he does occasionally smoke premium cigar. I LOVE the smell of a good cigar!
Miss August: Yep, I saw that when I was in Seattle last year. Never acquired the taste for cigars. Like pipes, I like the smell (Pipe smoke reminds me of my great grandfather), but don’t enjoy smoking them.
Is that why you leave the office when I’m smoking, baby?
LOL
hmmmm…..
If the guy that wrote 3000 died from passive smoke has got his facts right in the U.S. and the population there is 300 million, the odds for dying from passive smoke would 0.0001 per cent,more chance of winning the lottery
Read carefully – That’s 3,000 deaths caused by secondhand smoke from LUNG cancer alone. That excludes all other cancers, heart disease, emphysema, etc. Heart disease is the main killer.
This is from the American Cancer Society, perhaps this makes it clearer:
“Secondhand smoke causes almost 50,000 deaths in adult nonsmokers in the United States each year, including approximately 3,400 from lung cancer and an estimated 46,000 deaths from heart disease.”
Of couse, if you’re one of the unlucky 3000 it doesn’t really matter, does it?
Ian: That’s also what I have read, too. For the other causes, I think the “American lifestyle” impacts those figures. Once politics gets in the way of the truth, there is no longer any truth to be found.
It’s a shame all those incovenient facts obscure your concept of the “truth”. I guess I’ll stop running 4 miles a day and start smoking.
By making the voluntary choice to smoke tobacco you will die younger and reproduce less. It’s called Darwinian evolution, natural selection, thinning of the herd, etc.
One last thing – If you do it around me and I ask you to stop – nicely or not; you will stop.
You seem to have the majority on your side in this discussion. Congrats, you “win”.
Mike: OK… We’ve got a case of ITS here… Internet Tough Guy Syndrome. The reason that the opinion has gone against you is that most militant nonsmokers come off as a bunch of whiny pansies who want to control other people’s lives. That is why many people choose to live outside of the United States… There are few restrictions on personal freedoms here. (And, BTW, if I encounter a not very nice request, I highly doubt you would like my response. Speak to me in an uncivil manner, and that is exactly what you are likely to receive… along with a pack of Marlboros in a rather unpleasant place.)
And aren’t you doing the same thing?
I watched my own father drop dead of a massive MI in our living room at 52 – younger then I am now. When they autopsied him they found advanced heart disease; 100% caused by smoking. But that was a long time ago, before we were enlightened about the dangers. I sincerely hope that your children and loved ones never have to witness such a thing. I guess that’s why I’m passionate about this, and my health, but I would do not consider myself a nazi (your term) or ever call anyone else that. That’s a whold different concept. That’s all I have to say.
50,000 as a percentge of 300 million = 0.000166, so even then you have over 99.8% of not getting harmed by passive smoke.
If I’m in the restroom (or behind a light pole) and peeing, I don’t expect anybody to come between me and the urinal (or light pole) and block my trajectory. If they do, that’s their choice. Same with smoking, if you see me smoking, don’t come near me much less expect me to move away and smoke elsewhere. I also don’t approach or come near anybody when I have a lit cigarette (or when emptying my bladder).
Glenn: Common sense….
Hi John: Have you heard about the E-cigarette. No tobacco, no smoke,
just a vapor with graduated amounts of nicotine. Find it on line.
I agree with your reasoning, life is a matter of choices, some good, some bad, but they should always be ours.
Roberto.
Roberto: I haven’t seen those here… I’m thinking of checking it out next trip to the States. Possibly, they may have them in Singapore, since that country tends to have the tightest smoking restrictions in Asia.
Hi John;
Put a stick in and stir it! (LOL) You did fire up (pun intended) the Anti-Smoking Nazis. Let me preface my comments with this “I AM A SMOKER!”
I do not smoke in restaurants as I too don’t want to smell smoke while eating.
I do not smoke in my car, when a non-smoker is with me.
I do not smoke around children.
I will not smoke in someone’s house, I’ll just step outside.
I pay all taxes required to smoke and do not complain when non-smokers receive benefits from my tax.
I will smoke until I stop. (Which like you, has been many times)
I will not complain when people all over Asia smoke where ever they want. (It belongs to them)
I would never obey New Jersey’s asinine law that you can’t smoke in or around your house. (The anti-smoking Nazis next door can turn you in)
I will defend your right to smoke or not smoke, as I’m a 21 year military veteran and it’s what we do.
I will thank you John for clearing the air (yes, pun intended) on this subject.
I will also continue to drink ice cold San Magoo’s while smoking!!!
I will now have a cup of coffee, and a nasty dreadful cigarette.
I don’t like cigars, but I love their smell.
Paul: I see nothing in your comment to disagree with! We think alike on this. Enjoy your San Mig!