One question that I get from people all the time has to do with Citizenship. The question usually comes from Americans, and that is what I will address in this article, because since I am an American, I really don’t have much knowledge about Citizenship issues for Countries other than the USA and the Philippines.
The question that I hear all the times goes like this:
Questioner: OK, so you live in the Philippines? What do you do about your US Citizenship?
Me: What do you mean, I don’t understand what you are talking about.
Questioner: I mean, when was the last time you went back to the USA?
Me: It’s been about 9 years since I’ve been there, why?
Questioner: So, you aren’t a US Citizen any longer!
Me: Of course I am a US Citizen, why would you say that?
Questioner: There is no way that the USA will let you remain a Citizen if you don’t go there regularly!
No, I am sorry. Anybody who says this is absolutely incorrect. The fact is that even if you want to get rid of your US Citizenship, it is very difficult to do so! Yes, this is true. If you leave the USA, and never return, you will be a US Citizen for the rest of your life.
Under the US Immigration and Nationality Act, the citizen who wishes to relieve himself of US Citizenship must be in a foreign country, and go visit the US Embassy or Consulate. He/she must then appear before a US Ambassador or Consular Officer. The person will be interviewed (and dissuaded), and then must sign an oath of renunciation. This act alone still does not relieve you of your citizenship. A records search will take place, and if you have anything pending against you, if you have unpaid taxes, etc., you will not be allowed to renounce. You must clear up any pending matters in the USA before you will even be allowed to renounce your citizenship.
During the interview with the consular official, you will be asked a lot of questions. If any of your answers indicate that you have any desire at all to retain any privilege of US Citizenship, your renunciation will be denied. If you indicate that you ever think you might re-enter the USA, and stay there for any length of time, this can (and will) be interpreted as a sign that you desire to retain a privilege of US Citizenship, and thus your wish to renounce will be denied.
The fact of the matter is that the United States will work very hard to deny your desire to renounce your citizenship. Why? Because they want you to remain a taxpayer. If you are no longer a citizen, you will no longer be contributing your money to the operation of the US Government. If you live abroad, but keep your citizenship, you must continue to pay taxes, and the US Government wants you to do that!
So, in short, the answer to the question that I get many times every month is that I am indeed still a US Citizen, and I probably always will be. Right now, I see no circumstances under which I would renounce my citizenship. Now, I have considered obtaining Dual Citizenship, US and Philippine Citizenship, but I am still not certain that I would do so.
So, don’t worry, if you decide to become a resident of any country in the world, including the Philippines, you can, and will retain your US Citizenship, unless you work very hard to get rid of it!
Hi Bob!
Since you say that you are not sure if you will get a dual citizenship you must percieve there to be a disadvantage in doing so. Can you tell us what that might be? Maybe there is no advantage in doing so? I eagerly await your response.
Hi Bob!
Do you still have to file 1040 every year even though you earn your income in the Philippines? The reason I ask this is because I wonder if I have to file 1040 every year when I finally go back to the Philippines to live permanently.
Philippine Citizenship means only one major thing to me and an important reason to have it – Property ownership. My wife reaquired hers as many have and pretty much for this reason and also to avoid balikbayan fees. Being my usual negative self in all honesty who in aliens name would want to be a citizen of this place. Perhaps to avoid deportation. That is a real threat to any foreigner that lives here. Can you imagine that someone gets a bug up their butt and goes after another foreigner. Everything they have worked for or built here can be gone in 60 seconds. Scary. While I am proud to be an American I think if I could have a do over I would consider a place like Canada. Everyone loves Canadians. They can travel to any country in the world. They have great benefits for thier citizens. Only downside appears to be their taxation but a good accountant can help with that.
Hi Tom Ramberg – Yep, you are right. There are many advantages in my mind to gaining dual citizenship. There is one major disadvantage, though. I would then have to pay Philippine taxes. Right now, I am not liable to pay taxes to the Philippines, but if I were to become a citizen, then I would be liable.
Hi Beth – Actually, the truth is that I do not earn any of my income in the Philippines. 100% of my income is sourced from abroad. The truth is, though, as far as US Taxes are concerned, this is of no matter. No matter where you earn your money in the entire world, you must pay US Taxes, if you are a US Citizen. Most countries are not like this, but the US is.
There is no such requirement to pay US taxes no matter where you live.
Yes, you are required to pay US income taxes if you are a US citizen, no matter where you live. If you are one of these fellows who argues that the tax is voluntary or whatever…. how to you explain that all of those protesters always end up in prison?
Hi Steven – There are advantages to having Philippine Citizenship. Property ownership, as you say, is the major one. Yes, avoiding deportation is also a big one – they can't deport you if you are a citizen, after all. Based on what you have said on this site in the past, another difference between us is that I love the Philippines. I would be proud to be a Philippine Citizen, as I am proud to be an American. I love the Philippines, and thus becoming a Citizen is something that I would like to do.
Beth: Still fill out your 1040 every year. US expats are tax exempt up to around $85K, but you still need to file. You can run into big problems in the States that can get very expensive to sort out if you don't file. As to reporting Philippine income? You can't practically be taxed on what they don't know about, but you will be breaking the law. Also, keep in mind that relatively small wire transfers between here and the States are reported to the IRS. The tax laws are generally written to go after the big fish, but you can still be caught in the net.
oh oh 1040 ummm that is a new one …and i think I will let Jess be a citizen .. I'll hang out .. Phil n Jess
Hi Bob and John Miele,
Thank you for answering my question. I appreciate it!
🙂
Hi Bob,
Here is an interesting requirement for US citizenship of a baby born outside of the USA. In a nut shell, if a US citizen has a child with a Filipino citizen, the child will not be eligible for US citizenship if the US citizen has lived outside of the US for more than 5 years. So Bob, if one of your sons has a child with a Filipina, that child will not be a US citizen unless the 5 year residency requirement has been met. Here are some cuts and pastes from US government web sites . . .
The U.S. citizen parent must provide proof of his or her U.S. citizenship. The U.S. citizen parent also must provide substantial evidence that he or she was physically present in the United States for a total a five full years before the child was born and that two of those five years were after the parent's 14th birthday.
IF PARENT DOES NOT MEET REQUIREMENTS FOR TRANSMISSION OF CITIZENSHIP TO THE CHILD
If the child is not entitled to U.S. Citizenship and wishes to take up residence in the United States, he/she must obtain an immigrant visa unless he/she can qualify for naturalization as described in the paragraph below.
HOW TO QUALIFY FOR CITIZENSHIP THROUGH THE GRANDPARENTS
Whether or not the child intends to reside in the United States, an alternative procedure now exists for becoming a U.S. citizen. If the child is under eighteen years of age and has a U.S. citizen grandparent who meets the physical presence requirements as specified above, the child may qualify for expeditious naturalization under the Immigration and Nationality Technical Corrections Act of 1994. Although not entitled to U.S. citizenship at birth, the child can through this procedure, become a U.S. citizen by naturalization without first having to take up residence in the United States. It is, however, necessary for the child to travel to the United States for the naturalization, and all applications and documentation must be submitted and approved beforehand.
Well this is where I totally and emphatically disagree with you. You really can't have your cake and eat it too. I am watching President Obama's speech and I could not be more proud to be an American despite all the big problems the country has and pain Americans have to go through on a day to day basis. I could never consider being a citizen of any other country unless it is strictly for a business advantage as can be offered here as we both pointed out and only for that reason. But actually perhaps I wouldn't. A trust can be set up to get around the issue of property ownership. As for deportation. Hey thats a chance all foreigners take. And if it came to a point where I had to choose between the USA and the Philippines there would not even be a second thought about it and I seriously doubt any other American living here would feel differently. If they did they should give up their citizenship. Ask yourself that question.
I really love Italy, Mexico, Spain and could easily see myself living in those countries as well but change my loyalty. No way no how.
I do understand that you are in a somewhat unusual and difficult position as your entire business is tied to this country. If this country goes bad so does your business.
Hi Bob, Just for yours and your readers information, Canada also allows dual citizenship (since 1977). I have not opted for it. I have been in Austria for almost eight years now and have not been back to Canada. I am still a Canadian citizen. Pay Canadian taxes. In fact I must renew my passport this year, and I can do that at the Canadian Consulate in Vienna.
hi bob,
The philippine congress is now pushing for 100% property ownership for foreigner , they want to abolish the 40% cap, it is a long battle for the congressman who wants it but i can feel it will happen soon.
hi bob,
just for further reading about that issue, here's the link
http://businessmirror.com.ph/index.php?option=com…
hi bob,
when martin Luther king deliver the "I have a dream" speech in 1963, it only took 46 years and now the u.s. has an african-american president, before that, americans never thought of having a black president but it does happened.
all i am saying is, nobody knows what will happen in the future, maybe right now, foreigners living in the philippines are skeptic about the proposal. or maybe the proposal may gain support and could happen in the next couples of year.
Hi Bob
MY wife is going to re-gain her Philippine citizenship this year because I have been pushing for her to have dual citizenship. I want her to have it in case there is a problem when/or if we buy property in the Philippines. It will just avoid problems. The reason I am pushing to do it now is because both other kids are under 18 and qualify for Philippine citizenship too. If we wait, they would have to apply later as adults and probably would get refused or have a big hassle. If we own property there, I want the kids to inherit without problems. Thst my thinking.
Am I correct?
Bob could you please put me out of my misery and tell us are you, will you or have you applied for Pino Citizenship. As you have walked the tight rope of yes and no, there have been a few backflips, tumble turns and belly flops lol So whats the verdict champ?
really? you've actually been asked about losing your citizenship for living outside the US? i don't mean to be smug about this, i've just never come across anyone living abroad (including pinoys, and there are a lot of them) with these concerns. it just seems common sense.
i get slightly irked too about anyone's patriotism being questioned for making the decision to live abroad. i am filipino & a US citizen, so this come from both countries.
not to touch anything political, but the current president's mother lived for decades abroad & americans should not think less of her for choosing to do so. you shouldn't be shamed to stay within your country's playpens. that's present day north korean logic (or east germany, pick your era).
Hi Bob
Completely off the subject, but I have a few questions I would like everyone there to answer for their location. Maybe it is possible for you to write an article to get the answers. I just go off the phone with a friend who said:
Have you hear the Mr & Mrs X are moved back here from a small town in North Luzon (near Laoag City)? They say it has gotten too dangerous there. Murders, rapes, robberies, mugging, etc. Things are so tough that people are getting desperate. They packed up and moved back.
Now, I say the family "X" because I will be honest, I take everything that Mr. X says with a grain of salt, if you know what I mean. So, I do not want to name names.
I have always found him a little odd. You know how when some people tell you things, you think, "Yeah, right" ? That's how I feel about him.
But, how are things going there? Should I be worried about my in-laws? Are things getting tougher? Are people getting desperate?
Hi macky – sorry, I missed your comment there…
Most of the people who express this concern to me are people who have never traveled outside the country before, and are kind of naive about the whole idea.
I agree with you about patriotism and such, and it having nothing to do with where a person chooses to live.
Hi Allan Kelly – I don't think things here are any different than they were last year, or five years ago. It is no more dangerous than it was then, and probably even a little better.
Always good for an interesting comment exchange. Many folks are really concerned about the citizenship issue when they need not be. Another question I get all the time is, "But surely you must have to go back to the US at least every ten years to renew your US passport". Well, absolutely not on that issue also. In fact as I have written about several times, getting or renewing a US passport overseas is much easier than doing it in the US.
I got mny first blue "tourist" passport when I was living in Tokyo (i had a brown "Offical" passport at the time. On one trip back to the US the Immigration Office looked at my blue passport and asked, 'Did you lose your original'? No, I relied, this is my first tourist passport, ever."
The officer immediately got 'that look' and waved a supervisor over to the booth. After a few minute sof conferring, the original office turned back to me and said something I have often said myself … :"Sir, it isn't every day I learn something on this job, but thanks to you, I did learn something today. I did not know a US citizen could get an initial passport overseas. Pass on through and welcome home."
So even the USCIS/CBP guys get confused about expats living overseas. Maybe I should add that to my resume .. consulant/trainer to the USCIS? LoL
@ Allan Kelly: I don't live in Northern Luzon, I live in Central Luzon, but I certainly see nothing at all regarding the 'desparation' you mention. The average Filipino is doing well, or as well as can be expected I guess.
There have been some significant job losses involving some overseas companies, but there is also a _lot_ of building and business investment going on … not just call centers.
To their credit, the Philippine government has a comprehensive program in place for returning OFW's, something they never had before, and even the long-suffering Philippine WWII vets left alive just got a $15,000 USD stipend.
Will the Philippines suffer more later on this year or next? Certainly might happen, but also certainly not happening right now today.
My assessment is the same as Bob's … now well into my third year here, I feel things are calm and if anything, going probably a little better than when I first arrived.
Dave,
Get real, the Philippine government isn't giving the vets a dime nor would they as they prefer to steal than to give.
The US government is giving the surviving vets money that will ignorantly come out of a stimulus package designed to stimulate the US economy, not Philippine economy.
Vets with US citizenship will get 15,000 , Filipino citizens only 9,000.
In end some entrepreneurial pinoy who may well double as a caring politician will set up a shop to process the papers for these vets in exchange for 50% of the take. They do not care for the populace as politics is business, big business.
Regarding the Pinoys doing well, That's great to hear and hopefully they can up their exports by 500% in order to earn more money so they can truly excel. Sad thing is main export is PEOPLE and a vast percentage of the economy is remitted by these EXPORTED PEOPLE.
I don't know but if nations main export is people and those not exported are mostly over educated and yet unproductive I cant call that succeeding.
Justin
Truly anyone who can understand basic numbers can realize the Filipino politicians must steal or be out of work. Simply put vote buying cost millions of dollars so even wealthy politicians must steal in order to keep their jobs because if not they'd soon go broke due to vote buying without any ROI. PNP is no different either, oh those carrying public servants, how lucky their constituents must feel while having the food stolen right off their tables.
Yes Bob, there's anumber of different passports. The Official passport is for US government workers and military folks "Abroad on official business of the US government.". There are also several varieties of Diplomatic Passports for people under the jurisdiction of or traveling for the US State Department.
Technically you aren't supposed to go abroad on government business with a blue passport and you aren't supposed to travel for pleasure … like to visit another country while stationed overseas … on your offical passport. Rules, rules, rules 😉
Diplomatic status can be very interesting too … some of the rules of citizenship are even different for diplomats … example people born in the US whose parents are in the US on diplomatic passports don't become US citizens, whereas otherwise they would be eligible to claim US citizenship … check out the King of Thailand as an example, he was born in Massachusetts, but no, he isn't a US citizen by birth and never had a claim … becuase his parents were in the US as diplomats..
Goofy, at times, these 'rules of nationality'.
Bob,
So I will take that to mean that less will enroll in nursing with whole focus on going abroad and less fathers will allow their daughters to pimp themselves out on the net.
Justin
Bob,
Sorry about that, my apologies.
I guess its just my opinion that a nation is doing good when people do not feel forced out of feeling of desperation to exit said nation for purpose of improving ones socio economic status. I mean would really be great if people would focus on educational obtainments that they could utilize to improve their homeland for the better rather than to use their obtainments to seek a "better" life abroad.
My guess is isn't likely to change in our lifetimes save a complete economic meltdown because has been going on for at least a hundred years as if not mistaken Dr. Rizal mentioned it to (I think) Blumentritt in his correspondence and the example in that case was a Filipino orchestra in HK that played with the skill of any European orchestra of that era.
Truly my opinion is that many OFW may even cripple themselves by going abroad because in cases such as 2 yr non renewable contractual labor jobs that pay only 20tphp per month the person may have well better spent their time by entering local labor force in their home nation and built a name for themselves in their chosen profession.
Once again my apologies for poor attitude but truly would be nice to see Filipinos doing well by being employed in non exploitative manner and earning what would equate to a livable wage that enabled not only for the most basic of survivals in most cases.
Justin
Hello Bob,
Yes I guess it could even be beneficial to obtain improvements in baby steps so that the populace can grasp and latch onto the steps in small doses so that they can maintain the principals over a prolonged length of time. It could be effectively argued even that being thrust into change played a role in the development of the corrupt practices which now are so deeply ingrained in Philippine society that they may be considered as part of the cultural fabric.
Also, I once again apologize for my comment above regarding pimping as only after making the comment did I re-read it and see it comes across in bad taste and may offend some people for various reasons. In my opinion I do not have much respect for marriage brokers and the like but can realize that for a person in dire poverty such arrangements may present a opportunity to escape the grip of utter poverty and despair.
That said my apologies to anyone I may have offended by that statement which came across in a way that wasn't intended.
Justin
Hello Bob,
Well I'm not really sorry for my belief thinking the practice is wrong but am sorry for offending anyone with my beliefs and statements. Fact stands though that marriage brokers violate RA6955 and possibly also RA9208 as well and if laws where readily enforced they should face white slavery charges for their deeds of arranging marriages. I knew a couple guys many years ago who got caught running such a think by a GMA organized task force made specifically to bring them down, one guy fled nation ahead of hold departure other fellow got issued hold departure for charge of white-slavery.
Anyway, Back to topic , It is nice to know that steps are being taken to better life of Filipino people as no person deserves to be exploited.
Maybe Comandante Che put it best when he said something along the lines of no person can truly be free so long as there's a person in the world shackled by the chains of oppression.
Justin
Hello Bob,
Just entered my mind as it is a industry thats feeds on economic oppression and profits from exploitation.
Regarding the Philippines not feeling as much impact as other nations in regards to the economic crisis, This makes sense to me. One thing about being poor is ain't much lower to go, in this regard would seem that developing nations would not suffer as much from economic crises than would developed ones would, truly would be great if that is sign of economic improvements. Would be interesting to know if the Congo is feelings effects either to extent of United States, England and other developed nations.
Some years ago was a song a bit on this subject, Song was called Song of the South and was a portion that said "Well somebody told us Wall Street fell
But we were so poor that we couldn't tell"
My opinion is is improbable that Philippines would not be adversely effected to some extent by global economic downturn though as their economy depends so heavily on their people being employable abroad. Then again how much adversity could be felt in a nation where so much of the populace lives so far below poverty that the song quote above could apply to their situation.
I believe economic should be based on improvements and not just withstanding decline as nations benefit from new job opportunities. Now will be interesting to see how well foreign industries look at expansions in a slowed market. Would be great if Philippines could get some heavy investments capable of putting people to work.
I guess DPWH will employ the OFWs who have returned home due to job cuts in constructing roads. I wonder though how the salary will compare to the salaries in their lost jobs.
I believe in a nation that derives 75% of its economy from overseas remittances that economic downturn poses a threat to certain extent but it is good that until this point the effects on the Philippine populace have been minimal.
Justin
Sorry Bob
I didn't mean to get everyone off on a rant.
Bob, Dave, thanks for the reassuring comments. I thought it was BS, but wanted to make sure.
Justin. "get real". Philipinnes as you imagine will never make it, not at least in your lifetime. Do the honorable thing to do. Abandon all hope.
Roy,
I do not think I stated the Philippines will never make it. I believe that was your words. Furthermore I see absolutely nothing wrong ole bloke with a nation that would at least try to reduce exploitation and oppression but guess thats a bit hard to accomplish if the social hierarchy controls everything with a iron fist. I guess though I could state you have abandoned hope as from reading your posts I can only surmise that you took the easy way out and went abroad to attempt to accomplish what you obviously thought you couldn't accomplish at home. That stated I do not think your sarcastic attitude was fair to me as you yourself obviously thought your nation was oppressive, exploitative and possibly without hope as you left it to seek opportunity abroad and seldom does anyone leave home to migrate to new land if things are peachy at home. This stated are you a hypocrit or an elitist? Sorry if this is harsh but if shoe fits, wear it.
Justin
Roy,
I do not think I stated the Philippines will never make it. I believe that was your words. Furthermore I see absolutely nothing wrong with a nation that would at least try to reduce exploitation and oppression but guess thats a bit hard to accomplish if the social hierarchy controls everything with a iron fist and intentions fueled by corruption.
I guess though I could state you have abandoned hope as from reading your posts I can only surmise that you took the easy way out and went abroad to attempt to accomplish what you obviously thought you couldn’t accomplish at home.
That stated I do not think your sarcastic attitude was fair to me as you yourself obviously thought your nation was oppressive, exploitative and possibly without hope as you left your home for some reason and surely not because its economy was booming with job opportunities readily available for the masses.
Justin
Justin,
My short comment for you just summed what your posts had been all along, i.e." fathers pimping their daughters…" etc
.
& if you have been carefully reading my comments, I never trash my country. Only once did I say negative & that's referring to landlords. But it is what is
.
For all its faults, I love my country. & I did not claim that life is peachy there. That it's great there, oppurtunities abound. Filipinos leave primarily for lack of oppurtunities home. But that's not the only reason. I will not lecture you on other reasons but I will give you a clue. Other people of other wealthy nation also leave their country
.
Now we can at least agree that the Philippines is not as hopeless as I thought that you thought it was.
I strongly believe that that's your thesis all along. & I wonder to myself, here you are, a man coming from presumably a wealthy nation, being subjected to third world realities. How sad that is that you live those realities, I thought.
Justin, I will make it clear to you my personal agenda here. I exist as you see my beautiful picture, ehem, to try to explain the Philippines, the Filipinos to foreigners who are there. My goal is that the foreigners there will have a great time there, & not be frustrated by third world realities, or their impressions of the lack of laws there. That my friend is the only thing you will find in my comments.
Hello Roy,
I am glad to know you love your nation of birth despite its faults. Truth be told all nations have faults because if a nation existed with low living cost and no faults the populace of the world would be flocking there.
Poverty is not exclusive to the Philippines and coming from the deep south I can tell you that in the dirt poor delta poverty exists equal to what you see in the Philippines. I vividly remember as a teenager seeing homes that looked like junk there and which contained with out houses water pumps and located on roads so bad a fellow couldn't pass without a 4×4 . BTW, That was in America and not so long ago as I'm still 31yrs of age. Most those people where share croppers and exploited just as they are in your nation, I did not agree with that exploitation either and do not see my not condoning it as bashing my nation.
My personal belief is that the Philippines can change if they can eliminate corruption from the cultures fabric. I do not think it will happen in my life time or at least hope it doesn't as its my belief that change will come from the the blood of patriots as democracy only can succeed in nations who's soil is thoroughly saturated with human blood and who's political leaders fear the populace as its fear of the people and not a system of checks and balances which keeps political figures in line.
Sadly to say though I see America heading in same direction at present time as our own politicians no longer represent us the populace to extent that they should force the folks up in Washington to wear nascar type jackets so at least we know upfront who their sponsors are and who's interest they are acting in behalf of.
Justin
Justin, I was not only born there. I left there when I was 35. People think that the US is a rich country. I thought that too. Foreigners like Pete, or Steven trash the Philippines like this is the worst country. At one point, Pete described one Phil hospital where preganant women give birth amidst dogs and cats and raw sewage.
But you said that US has a poor side too–the south. & if I may add, the appalachian region. It was no payatas or phil dump site but you' d see there white 40 yrl old grandmom who's toothless already. Americans have beautiful set of teeth but not those people.
The point is poverty everywhere.
Roy,
If he really see that kind of hospital then why not describe it? I mean maybe he doesn't intend to insult a person by his description but rather just wants to open the peoples eyes by pointing out what he saw.
I am surely not sure if he was exaggerating or not but feel he may have well been giving a accurate description of what he saw. I myself have seen a hospital in your country much like what he was describing and one that was worse. The one similar to his description was a provincial hospital where they had the open sewage that was common, ward type rooms with beds with no foam, new mothers breast feeding in plain view, a drug store void of all medications, equipment that looked to be many decades past its prime and etc, even had rats running around the place and was very filthy.
I never once saw a woman deliver birth in hallway though but did once witness a birth take place on a bamboo floor as person was to poor to even afford fare to public hospital, my wife's nursing class ended up delivering the baby and for a long time we had the birth on cellphone video but no longer do I know what became of it.
The worse medical facility I ever saw was in a far flung barrio where the people there even in their homes had no phones, no running water, no cable, no cell site , no electricity and truly no nothing. Believe it or not card board boxes where prized possessions in that place, that said you can probably guess the condition of their medical facility.
Anyway, Maybe that poster wasn't trying to insult you but just trying to point out what he had seen in hopes that it will discourage very sick foreign nationals from moving to a nation where medical care isn't always cheap and where at times medical facilities are very primitive.
Justin
Justin, thanks for explaining a basic concept to Mr Roy. I didn't want to go into graphics or details or to insult, suffice to you said it all. Also, I don't trash the Pines, some people do a good job of it themselves, Sir!
Pete,
No problem. I believe though the Filipinos do remarkably well at many tasks despite what limited resources they have at their disposal. Can you imagine asking a American construction crew to build a house using only the very basic tools the Filipino construction crews use, my guess is all would quit.
My belief is that maybe Roy is just sensitive about the issue since it is his homeland being discussed. I would possibly be irritated as well if a bunch of foreign nationals just say not so positive things about my nation even if the things they said where true. When away from home people often have tendency to remember the good but not the bad.
Justin
On second though, would be hard these days to find a "American" construction crew as mostly the construction guys seem to be Latinos these days. I'm unsure if they can use the basic tools like the Filipino construction workers use but one things for sure, the Latino crew would work circles around the Filipino crew and do better quality work as well. Is really kinda funny if can hit a cement wall with a hammer and break large portion of wall down in one hit, I saw that happen in past though but was in a low end subdivision.
In a later article of Bobs, "plumbing frustration" I talked about my building project. Yes, ur right again, my workers used a tape measure, pencil, manual saw, hammer, a trowel ….wait on i'm thinking…..nail & hose as a chisel. The only power tool used was a grinder and that died after one hour lol. But amazing work.
Justin & Pete,
I have asked Pete to name the hospital but he refused to. Why? Afraid? You come from wealthy nations, your embassy will protect you.
Do you know that by naming the hospital, you have done a great service to the Filipino race. Or if not your embnassies so they can issue travel advisories against visiting those hospitals.
Cats & dogs, raw sewage seeping & women giving birth are images that are hard for me to imagine at least in one room. That said, if it truly exist, name it pls. & if I may ask this, what's a foreigner doing in those establishments?
Truly it boggles my mind, why a foreigner would inflict upon themselves all subhuman experiences (third world amenities) when I am a Filipino myself had done a good job not experiencing those I do not understand this for the life of me. This is worth explaining, Justin & Pete. WHY? Why do you experience squalor when you there are establishments in the Phil that can approximate world class facilities. I do not understand this. Clearly, we have opposite realities. I know that the Phil is poor but I tried to use the best facilities when I was there. When I travelled outside of Manila, I make sure that I go to places that have indoor plumbing. If not, I do not make a stink out of it because I knew what to expect.
Foreigners/tourists who insist on experiencing third world facilities (when clearly there's alternative not to) should not be complaining about it–they have no right to do so in the first place. It's simple. If you want first class hospital facilities, go to the names of hospital I enumerated. If you want first class hosp in the provinces, we cannot give you that. The best alternative is that you leave the Philippines.
& Pete, what's the "basic concept" w/c you thanked Justin for "explaining" it to me. I had a hard time following his 1st paragraph which is this & I quote:
"If he really see that kind of hospital then why not describe it? I mean maybe he doesn’t intend to insult a person by his description but rather just wants to open the peoples eyes by pointing out what he saw."
Whatever you maent by that, I stand by what I have asked: name the hospital so that as you pointed out people's eyes can not only open their eyes but can actually avoid it bec you gave them warning by identifying the hosp.
Our discussion will never end unless we meet our two opposing issues. You claim such hospital exists. I go no, it doesn't unless you name it.
Just for the sake that you were able to identify the hospital–and this goes for you Justin & Pete–I'd like to ask this million dollar question:
Why would a a tourist in a third world country insist on using third world facilities when clearly there are alternatives that can meet or at least approximate ostentatious amenities that you are accustomed to–why?
Is it for the love of adventure? Then, blame yourselves. Or is it economics? Still blame yourselves. You get what you paid for–or not even have paid for.
Quite right, Roy. Pete and Justin are one and the same person, except that these two heads need banging together for the simple reason one or the other cannot name the hospital because, after all, it was a figment of their wretched imagination—nothing more. A truly inventive way of destroying the country they live: when one complains about things like that, he at least should have the guts to be honest and truthful about it. But, loathesome as they are to their adopted country, they recoil at the thought that they've been found out. Truly, an exaggeration of such proportion speaks more about their lack of formal education than their lack of knowledge about the country they are in at the moment.
I get the feeling that Steven, Justin, and Pete are one and the same.
Opps not so fast, Jenny. Really? I didn't think that these two men are one & the same. But they got me confused though. Justin, Steven but Pete, no.
Anyway, I just need to point this out that let us not be presumptous to say thay they consider the Phil, as their "adopted country". I'm sure they are there for some other reason than the to frolick in our beaches, get tanned in Boracay, commune w/ nature in Palawan or do all sorts of touristy things. Because if they are there for those reasons, I cannot imagine how they encountered again, "cats and dogs, raw sewage seeping & women giving birth" all in the same room.
I spent 35 years of my life there and I have never encountered anything of that sort. I am convinced that these people who are impersonating as tourists are not the kind of tourists that the Phil should have. & for that reason, I am truly sorry for my country if this is the kind of tourist that we can cajole in staying there.
Roy,
I will name the terrible hospital I saw. The one was named Provincial Hospital in Butuan City Agusan Del Norte Philippines, The other was a small municipal hospital someplace in Surigao Norte.
I know good and well what I saw and if youll kindly post your email address I will happily send you pictures of the pathetic conditions of the provincial hospital in question.
Justin
Jenny,
Before stating Ill not name the hospital please have the common decency to request it be named. Anyway, As you wished it is named, you state youll fic the problems. Now you know the place so put up or shut up , balls in your court.
Justin
Roy,
BTW, I never used those terrible hospitals as had money to go elsewhere as does my wife. However, I did visit the places in order to see my less fortunate friends (your country men) who had to use such piss poor fascilitys due to their economic conditions. Frankly, I found all the hospitals that I saw in Mindanao to be substandard and filthy.
Do you also want me to name the fiscals and judges I saw bribed and the military men I saw delivering "savings: to NPA, if so I have not the slightest problem in naming names.
You ole boy know now the hospital so put up or shut up, balls in your court.
BTW, I aint steven nor pete, Im Justin,
Justin
Hello Bob,
Im not hostile but Roy seems to be calling me a liar. I have absolutely no reason to be untruthful about the poor conditions of medical conditions I saw as stand to gain nothing by telling him of the unfit medical fascilities. I though do feel that being indirectly called a liar and a troll is far more hostile than speaking of the poor conditions.
Anyway, Hopefully he will respond with his email address as just so happens a Filipino organization based in America is raising money to better that particular facility and have many pictures on a website for people to see. I have saved the pictures and look forward to sdending them to Roy so he can see them, as they say a picture speaks a thousand words.
Justin
Hello Bob,
Curios question, can I cut a picture and paste it in this text box and have it post on list for Roy or is that impossible? I ask because just remembered it is against your rules to post email addresses so Roy obviously cant do that.
Justin
Roy,
Click link below as it will show you pictures of facility in question although these pictures do not show the full magnitude of the poor facility which I speak as they do not show the pharmacy bare of all medications, the rats running in hallway and etc.
Also, Bear in mind this link is not controlled by a American bashing your nation but rather two Filipino Doctors who are based in America and have a legal non-profit that tries to help fascilities such as one in picture below.
Pay particulair attention to pages 15 and 18 in link below as they show hospital, the link controls other stuff as well but pages 15 and 18 are the ones on topic here.
http://www.butuanon.org/yabb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.c…
Happy Looking,
Justin
Hello Bob,
Thanks for that information. Instead though I just gave my good friend Roy the link to pictures placed in a forum by two of his country men who practice medicine in America yet posted the pictures to open the eyes of people such as Roy to the true condition of many of the glorious medical facilities within the Philippines.
The facility in pictures is actually worse in person than in pics but in no way can Roy honestly tell me the pictures on page 15 and 18 of above link display a truly decent medical facility as the conditions are disgusting.
Justin
Justin,
You still did not name the hospital. I want you Justin to name the hospital, right here.
So that's what you do touring MIndanao hospitals just to be grossed out. Get a life. Better yet, go to other wealthy nations and rave how nice their hospitals are.
Sorry Bob. If Justin had been fortright all along and identified the name of the hospital from the very start, this argument would not have lasted this long.
Instead he chose to just provide the link, & tell me that those pics were provided by two unamed Fil doctors working in the US.
Did he really think that that would be enough to establish credibility on his sources w/c would further corroborate his claims? Very smart person.
A final word Justin. There's more abject poverty you can encounter there in Minadanao if you stay there more. What are you gonna do–continue make a stink out of it? Yes, you do that…that might help alleviate the poverty level of my countrymen. Because as it is, they should be kissing your bleeping bleep for everyday pointing out to them how bad it is for them.
My bad Justin. I'm sorry….so you did name the hospital in your previous post. Butuan. Ok, I give it to you that what you claim could be true. That my total disbelief over that is unwarranted.
My advice to you though is stay away from those hospitals. Unless you have a genuine desire to bring civilazation there. By all means, help my countrymen by reporting it to your embassy or anybody just to get your message across.
But if yYou & your wife have no use for it, then as far as you are concerned over it, those places do not exist. Unless you are galvanizing people here to improve it. Otherwise, choose your places to know & to go to. Do not go to poverty stricken places because what you will find there are ..guess what…poverty and everything attendant to it..like rats…all the ugly stuff.
Roy,
I hate to say this but truthfully the condition of a provincial hospital is of no true importance to the United States embassy. I mean sure they may at times give donations or etc but it is truly a issue best reported to a Philippine entity since it is a domestic problem. The problem is who will you report it to with the politician who runs it herself steals the funds from it to finance the furtherment of political career.
Oh, BTW, I have no reason to lie to you but if you want to know the two Filipino doctors spoken of who actively engage in helping such places are readily named right in the link to forum I gave you together with the photographs of the decrepit medical facility being spoken of.
Furthermore before asking I be more forthright think before typing as truly the names of the facilities in question are irrelevant to this conversation as the point was that such facilities indeed exist in your beloved country.
Also, Great outlook on poverty you have. Shut your eyes and ignore its existence. What a Noble attribute from a person who self professes to love his homeland yet chooses to remain ignorant of the realities it contains. Talk about rose colored glasses. Your kababayan are truly lucky to have you in their corner.
Sorry but you have thoroughly enraged me by running your talking out your rear while calling me a liar as well as either a troll or a sock puppet.
Justin
Roy ,
Could be true, Good grief you have pics lolol. Please tell me you see that decrepit hospital in pics as being a fine facility which you wish to be representative of your beloved nation.
BTW, Quit asking us to fix your problems and fix them yourself as they are your problems since your profess to adore your nation are is that adoration simply pseudo adoration which exist up to talking only.
Justin
Roy,
Where in Philippines are you from? If your from imperial Manila it explains allot as your place is decent, the provinces are not. In Butuan all the medical facilities are disgusting, the best was Butuan doctors but even it is truly a sorry place to extent that anyone with decent money went to Cebu or Manila for serious problems. Example is when my wife's cousin got shot twice in head while enrolling in school, they had him airlifted to Cebu via helicopter and spent around 3 million keeping him alive, in province he would have died, thats reality,
Justin
Justin,
Do us a favor, GROW UP! (attitude wise of course!) Then post as many comments as you want. Then this website would be a much better experience for us readers of this website.
This article is about Citizenship (Bob's, in particular). Your rant about the negative things about the Philippines will not help alleviate those things you mentioned (like dirty hospitals, etc.). I have yet to feel in your comments if you're really coming from concern for the poor people of the philippines but right now I just see black smoke spewing from your fingers as you type your comments.
Hello Bob,
Sorry but it is my opinion that when someone continues questioning my morals I have the obligation to defend myself from such attacks.
Anyway, I apologize for my off topic posting on this thread but by all means people rather American nor Pinoy should be allowed to criticize people such as Steven, Pete and Myself either unless we be given fair opportunity to defend ourselves.
Roy has called me a truthfulness on the issue, called me a sock puppet and even questioned my intelligence. To me this is a direct attack and it is only fair that he also be asked to drop topic as well, besides seems to me I have more than provided enough evidence to prove my point.
That stated I will no longer post on this as you have asked but I shall not apologize for defended my position when attacked by a cowardly keyboard commando who spews unfounded accusations even after evidence has been served to him on a silver platter.
I do though apologize for off topic comments. My sincere apology in that regards.
Justin
anonymous,
You seem real grown up posting under the nic anonymous, coward is term I think. Didn't your momma ever teach you that you shouldn't write anything you'll not put your name to. Bet your momma doesn't even know your up so late does she? Grown up bloke you are LOLOL.
Justin Arledge
Bob,
May I ask why they can insult and criticise me at whim yet it only I who gets told to behave? You own this site and by all means you can do as you please for that reason but would truly be only fair to apply rules to all involved equally rather than to allow one member to be publicly bashed while placed under gag order which gives them no opportunity to defend themselves.
Justin
Hello Bob,
Understood and seems fair enough.
From this point on I will no longer post on this topic even if Roy or "Mr. Anonymous" chooses to address a post to me. I only ask that if people make disparaging comments towards others they be warned against doing such regardless of the nic, race or skin color.
Again my apologies for off topic posting on this thread and this will be last post.
Sincerely,
Justin
Hi Bihye – Firstly, are you here legally for 20 years? I mean, do you have some kind of visa that has allowed you to stay that time? Of course, you cannot vote here – you are not a citizen. SSS, Job… it all depends on your legal status. If you are here illegally without a visa, then you need to get it all straightened out.
hi again Bob, yes i have a visa, and my we've been renewing it…, so that means i can get a job?, and is there other things that i need to know, other than that?
Hi Bihye – There are many different kinds of visas, some allow you to work and others don't. If you have been here that long, you must have some kind of residence visa, which would generally allow you work.
Hi Bihye – I'm glad that the info helped you out. Good luck with the working!
hi bob! i am super excited to have found your blog.
i am, right now, a permanent resident at the US.
my question is, if I ever become a citizen of the US, can I go back here in the Philippines
and stay here for as long as I want, and obtain dual citizenship?
Right now, I can only leave the US for not more than 6 months.
And as much as i like to have the opportunity that the US offers,
I dont think I can go back and forth, US – Phil – US – Phil, at 6 months each for the rest of my life.
what I really want is to live here in the Philippines, but still have the flexibility to go back to the US anytime I want.
Is this possible?
I have read articles online stating that even as a US citizen, I still cant leave the US for more than 6 months. and this is just a complete buzzkill for me. 🙁
Hi Justin – You didn’t say, but I am basing this answer on the fact that you are a Philippine Citizen now. If so, no problem. You seem to be desiring US Citizenship. If so, go ahead and become a US Citizen if you qualify. Once you do that, you can fill out a form and take an oath at your nearest Philippine Consulate, and you will be a dual citizen at that point. It’s simple and straightforward.
Hello Bob , I’m a immigrant visa in america , but im now staying here in philippines. I’ll be staying here for 6 months which is in August 23 2011. But I’m planning to stay here more than 1 year. I can’t apply for re-entry permit since I’m working and not studying at all. What I must do ? and about Fiancee Visa. If ever I stay in america and leave here before the end of 6 months stay here in philippines. What are the requirements for the Fiancee visa? Do I need to earn 2.5k $ just to get my love one? Thank you in advance , my friend. 🙂
I am sorry, Lester, I really don’t know about that. It’s been over 20 years since I went through the process and I am sure a lot has changed.
Do you have any idea what income tax is? It’s a tax on earned income. For instance, if you are not employed, you do not have to pay income tax. When did you ever hear of pogroms of college students for not paying income tax? Or high school students?
Further, if you are receiving social security and the like, you are not required to pay income tax, as it is not earned income. Additionally, even if you are working, there is a certain amount one has to earn in order to meet the income tax requirements. Not to mention, in most cases, volunteering tax on a foreign income is entirely dependent on one’s own decision, as there is no way for the US government to find out.
I have not paid income tax in years. Neither have most people in America. Or at least most people I know. The idea that US citizens are the only people required to pay income tax anywhere they are, at any time is absolutely ridiculous. Get your facts straight before you go posting BS online.
Tristan – Get your facts straight, and before you start judging me, learn more about me first. I do have to pay US income tax. I am not retired, and I am employed. Don’t make people think you are a fool just because you didn’t do your homework.