Can a foreigner expect to get justice in the Philippines? Just ask Marine Lance Corporal Daniel Smith. Smith was convicted of rape in 2006. The “crime” supposedly took place in November 2005, while Smith was in the Philippines to participate in joint military exercises between the US and Philippine militaries. Smith and several other Marines were accused of rape by “Nicole” (a cover name given to the “victim”). Nicole’s true identity has now been revealed, she is Suzette Nicolas of Zamboanga City.
Since 2006, Daniel Smith has been incarcerated for the rape, and has been awaiting appeal. This week, Suzette Nicolas recanted her account of events, and has sworn a new statement indicating that she is not sure if she was raped or not.
Not sure? Back when Smith was convicted of the “rape” Suzette said that if she had her way, Smith should be killed for what he did to her. Now she says that she thinks that she may have consented to any sex that may have occurred. Actually, she is not even sure that there was any sex!
One of the things that really bothers me about this chain of events is that Justice Secretary of the Philippines, Raul Gonzales says that Suzette Nicolas, back before the trial, wanted to change her statement and withdraw much of what she said, but he would not allow her to do so. So, based on this, it would seem that Philippine Officials knew in advance of the trial that the event may have never even occurred, yet they continued with the prosecution anyway! Is that justice?
Another funny thing about this is that Suzette Nicolas, through her mother, is now saying that she is withdrawing the case because she is tired of it, and that “there is no justice in the Philippines.” No justice? She is right. It’s not justice when you falsely accuse somebody of rape and an innocent man is convicted of the crime. That certainly is not justice.
One thing that I also find interesting about this case is that over the years, “Nicole,” has been held up in such high esteem by Filipinos. It has been as if she was a Saint. Now that she has recanted, a lot of people are saying that it is because she was paid off, or pressured by the US or Philippine Government to do so. Before she was said to be so honest. Now that she recanted, people say that it is not true that it didn’t happen. So, she is telling a lie now? If she is being dishonest now, how do we know that she wasn’t dishonest before? Well, the fact is that she is saying now that she did lie before.
As of now, Smith still languishes in incarceration. He is being held by the US Embassy in Manila, awaiting his final appeals. Since Suzette Nicolas has now cleared Smith of wrongdoing, he will be released soon, though, right? Not so quick. Philippine “Justice” officials say that Nicolas’ recantation has no affect on Smith’s status, though. Even though his “victim” says that she lied to the court, they still want to keep him in jail! Is that justice?
Personally, I have never had any problems with the Philippine Justice system, but seeing how this case has been handled, and how it continues to be handled certainly makes me think twice, though.
Oh, by the way… any guesses what happened to Suzette Nicolas? As of last week, she is living in the USA with her American boyfriend!
This whole case only encourages people to repeat the act. A woman can falsely accuse a foreigner of rape, get him convicted, then recant years later. She’ll get money (Nicolas got P100,000 from Smith to cover damages against her) and possibly even a visa to go live in the States! That’s a lot of incentive for a poor Filipina to make false accusations against any foreigner she can find.
Justice? For me it is certainly absent here. What do you think?
I lived in Olongapo for 5 years and it was not uncommon for a girl friend who felt she was dumped by the man she loved to have him put on military hold until her lawyer and family received a settlement ($5,ooo) from the navy.
I wonder how her lying to the courts will affect her future paperwork to REMAIN in the US?
Bob sorry to be blunt but
Just a Whore that cried rape to take advantage of a American.
Her next step will be to trick her US boyfriend into getting her pregnant then dumping him followed up by getting Child Support, Welfare and Foodstamps.
As I mentioned before dirty deeds are done very cheap there in RP and some of his Marine Brothers should have taken care of business.
i'm on the dissenting view here, bob. i actually got the impression that the family never got the full support of the government & that cpl. smith has been treated lightly.
also, what i've actually gathered from other pinoys, is that the woman was being blamed for being raped because of being "easy". it bothers me whenever rape is blamed on the victim. i actually think that the mom saying that there is "no justice in the philippines" meant they truly feel frustrated & abandoned by their own country.
there is the perception that there was no way this philippine government put it's full support on one non-influential filipina and draw the ire of a US gov't. it's all the more disillusioning (is that a word?) when we see our japanese & korean neighbors giving their all out support for their own citizens in similar cases.
i've also read nicole's recantation &, to me, it sure seemed like she just wanted to forget everything & leave the country. she pointed out that she had vague memories of being fondled (which doesn't disprove the rape), being dropped off in a lighted place instead of a dimly lit area (how polite of them). i'll spare you the rest of my observations.
i was actually upset when my "favorite" cabinet member, raul gonzales, said that she should have gone to italy instead of the US. in essence, saying her flight to the US seemed hypocritical . i thought that was absurd. but then again, that man has said more idiotic things.
lastly, i've read that her american fiance's family has been supportive of her for the past 2 years, even shortly after incident hitting the press. i actually thought this was a nice angle in this story because it showed people seeing past nationalist fervor (which i abhor) to help each other out.
i'm not sure where to place the rumored P100,000 payoff that nicole's lawyer confirmed that Smith's side payed her client's family. But if true, that adds to yet another side to this already bothersome saga.
to close, i'm not one to put saintly perceptions on anyone including nicole as you've alluded to other pinoys. i do however think the philippine government once again came up short here & that this is yet another case of how little value is placed in regular citizens.
nicole simply gave up & left the country, a feeling many filipinos can relate to.
Bob,
I wonder how she got her visa to the U.S.? Does she have family in the States or did she marry a citizen? If she was sponsored by a family member, she should still be waiting for approval. That is unless maybe the U.S. government expedited her approval in return for other considerations; like maybe changing her story.
I tend to believe that the relationship was consensual if not a business transaction, but that is only my opinion. I'm sure a U.S. serviceman would NEVER engage in that type of business!
Mark C.
"Just a Whore that cried rape to take advantage of a American."
neil, you just made my point here. it's easy to look on the surface and place labels such as one above.
the woman is said to be from a prominent zamboangan family & it may be possible that she was actually
assaulted.
nevertheless, whatever her background, whether a prominent scion or from the streets, i am uneasy whenever words such as "whore" (or "slut" or "asking for it") are used on an alleged victim in a rape case.
We can all learn by others mistakes, right or wrong. It's bad for the U.S.A and the Philippines..JC
sound like somebody got the old boot up the wazoo 🙁 …Phil n Jess
Bob: The reality of the situation is probably somewhere in the middle.
The Marines essentially picked up this girl in a bar in Subic… Not normally the type of place you go to find a girl to bring home to momma.She was probably out to scam them and got burned. Needless to say, these were probably not boy scouts.
The girl, according to several articles I've read, had medical evidence of rape. She was drunk, could have given consent, or otherwise, but there was evidence.
US Military have a history of bad behavior at overseas posts. I can think of several high-profile incidents in Okinawa and Korea off the top of my head. US Military make easy marks, and though the US Military tries to warn, make off-limits, etc, these guys don't always do the smart thing.
My feeling is that she tried to scam them, earn money, or whatever, and things got out of hand. In any event, the guys were stupid… They put themselves into a situation where they could take a huge fall. Not much sympathy from me for Smith, in any event.
As to the girl, She got what she was looking for, and I also feel little sympathy (Nice girls do not go into vans with four strange men they meet in a bar).
Scams happen all over the world. There are many players in the bar scene in the States. This incident just got politicized due to the VFA.
I agree that Lance Corporal Daniel Smith was not given a fair trial.
By belief is that "Nicole" was being used by feminist groups in the Philippines to further their agenda. It was reported during the trial that "Nicole" wanted to change her story, probably to something more truthful, but she was not allowed.
I don't think any justice system is flawless, but I would never want to be subjected to the Philippine justice system, or the resulting incarceration.
BTW, in the Philippines, having sex with someone to drunk to make a rational decision about consent, can be considered rape.
I think that the story now told by "Nicole", seems far more credible about what happened that night. Just maybe her conscience has been bothering her, but who knows her motives now.
She has greatly affected Lance Corporal Daniel Smith's life, something that she can now never change. I don't think people should be treating her with much respect or sympathy. She knew the truth back then, just as well as she knows the truth now.
From a woman's perspective…
If I was raped, there is nothing in this world that would make me recant my story. I wouldn't want to forget it happened or give up, as Macky explained her actions. I would fight tooth and nail, whether my government is behind me or not.
She's a liar then if not now. And the worst thing, Ms. Nicolas is slapping the faces of actual rape victims by crying wolf.
Just giving in my two centavos worth here…
I actually think there was a rape that occurred.
She was probably just pressured by the government, to just drop the thing because they no longer know what to do anymore. Putting Smith in Philippine jail would probably incur the wrath of the United States (being a Filipino, I am kind of sad at this fact really…with the country not being able to freely put local interests above foreign ones….still begging for scraps from the richer nations), and giving Smith over to the U.S. would probably incur the wrath of the people saying the government "sold out."
So how do you fix it? Pressure her and pay her off. If there was no rape that occured, there's no case, and if there's no case, there's no problem as to where to put Mr. Smith.
Being a Filipina in which harmony/SIR is more important than confrontation, choose harmony! Especially when confrontation seems to go nowhere, except bring one heck of a mess to the country and one's life, and harmony gets you a visa to the U.S. and P100,000 worth of pocket money. Which would any of us choose, I wonder?
Call me a cynic, or a biased local, but thar you go 🙂
P.S. – I also just want to say that though coming from a prominent family doesn't absolve anyone of anything or prove their innocence, the "good girls" that I know from "good" families tend to act as lady-like as possible as to not bring shame/disgrace to their family name, which would make the rape accusation more plausible…
…And Paris Hilton wasn't raised in a Filipino environment was she? I don't think shame/disgrace/family honor, etc. is not as engrained in the American Psyche (anymore?) as it is in Filipinos (ulaw/hiya)…
Hi, Has anyone considered that the girl got caught out by her 'prominent' family and they frowned upon her 'fling' or whatever it was with the soldier and made her cry wolf? Just a thought, its happened plenty of times before.
Cheers.
Bobs' original theme was "Can a foreigner expect to get justice in the Philippines?"
I believe in this case justice will be served if the marine is acquited and allowed to stay in the military.
In general, I think the mark of a "civilized" society is that it applies it's rules fairly to everyone regardless of citizenship. If the Philippines hopes to ever get out of Third World status, the expectation of just treatment of foreign visitors will have to be generally accepted by the global community at large. Unfortunately, I don't think this is the case at this time. So my answer to the question is "no".
Mark C.
If you go elsewhere and read online this is and has been a scam used by filipinas for awhile. Typically this is how it goes, pinoy girl meets foreigner guy ,bar , street, does'nt matter where, she goes to his hotel has sex with him, after sex she tells him pay her x amount or she will say she was raped. Guy either pays or gets busted.
Variation: Of age girl does the above and mentions to guy in hotel she has sexy younger friend who would like to join in…girl texts friend, she shows up..says before boom boom she wants to shower..in shower texts policeman who is in on this….cops show up..find girl in shower is underage…guy gets busted…can get of the hook for X amount or face long jail term.
I always read the current scams going on before i visit each year..most are not related to sex but makes for interesting reading.
PS . do i think being an american I could get justice in the RP? Sure …if I pay enough for it!!
Face it …we are a walking lottery ticket.
Hi Bob!
Another angle that hasn't been mentioned is the activists that hate the American military in the Philippines. I see them complaining when the US military is doing humanitarian work or helping with logistics on the terrorism problem. Is it possible that they also helped to fan the flames on this to create a reason to throw the US military out?
Hi Bob – Back when the USN had its bases in the Phils, such incidents would be settled by a little "dungaree liberty" – the base's enlisted personnel would put their dungaree (work) uniforms on, go out the gate (officially, dungarees were not allowed outside the gate or to be "seen in public"), and proceed to physically wreck and destroy any bar, business, or whatever that was connected with the incident. Not a nice method of establishing good relations, but it did have the ability to keep those incidents to a minimum as the "locals" feared reprisals from the base.
As for Nicole, there she was that night, stripped to her knickers, trying to get back home and being seen by others in such a state. What else would a gal do in order to keep her dignity intact?
I feel sorry for her. She learned the hard way that fun times don't come free.
For Cpl Smith – Semper Fi.
From the start, this case always left a bad taste in the mouth. Hard to say for sure whether a rape did occur or not, I wasn't there. As a woman though, if I was raped by an American as it was described during the hearings, the US would be the last place I'd migrate to to forget what happened. I'd almost bet there was a deal struck with Nichole – money and migration. We all know how difficult it is for a young woman to get a US visa! Funny though, of all the times to migrate to the US, this is certainly a lousy time to do it – recession and all…
As for the VFA, governments don't sign an agreement and then take it back! Shamef..ul that this is even being discussed by people in government who were in one way or another responsible for it.
I don't know a lot about this, really haven't kept up on it so correct me if I'm wrong.But didn't she go into this bar and van willingly? I'm curious what people still defending her thought were her reasons for going into a bar well known to be filled with young horny military men? That's well before she apparently willingly got into a van with 4 of those horny young military men.
I will be honest I don't think their was a problem until she was humiliated by being dumped out in public. Honor is highly valued in Philippine culture. This ruined her chances of being respected in her home town and likely getting ANY Philippine man to marry her. It certainly was mean for them to do this and a 100K Pesos is probably a fitting punishment for it though its little enough. The problem was she cried rape to try to salvage her reputation. I hardly think Smith(and buddies) letting people know her real character was worth him going to jail over.
If this had been Philippine military men in the bar and van and she cried rape everyone would have had a good laugh at the joke. This is plainly racism.
Can any of you still defending her look someone in the eye and say you believe that if she had gone to a bar that was a local hang out for Philippine military men and left with 4 Philippine military men in a van that this wouldn't have been laughed out of court? I hate to be so blunt again this is plainly racism if you cant say that.
hi bob,
coincidence or not? Ms. Nicolas recantation came after both U.S. and Phil President talked and re-affirming the VFA status.
Hi Bob
It was obvious from the start that when Smith and the other servicemen went to trial, someone was going to get convicted to please the leftists and some of the nationalists. Gonzales (dont know how he is still in the cabinet) said that if he revealed evidence only if he was in the mind to that the trial would have ended in all of them being found not guilty. This was before the trial started. Now he has finally revealed what that was.
The leftists have a passion in hating the U.S., though I believe Philippines will have a much greater issue dealing with China especially conidering the Spratly islands but that is another subject. They put all the problems in the Philippines on the U.S. Suzette gave them a chance to attack the U.S. as being savage and raping an innocent girl. Any lady needs to realize that an American seviceman or any young man will usually jump at the chance of having sex with a young lady. When they got drunk and dancing together that night and then got into the back of the van, Smith assumed Suzette wanted to have sex with him. She may have consented or her lack of resistance suggested to him she wanted to have sex with him. I believe that when they dropped her off and with her clothes half removed and people saw her in that condition she felt or wanted to claim that she was raped to cover her emberassing situation.
There is a reason why the U.S. signed the VFA with Americans having jurisdiction over their men until all trials are over. Due to the amount of corruption in the judges there, they do not want their guys to be railroded and put into prison. (They are investigating judges who decided in the favor of the Legacy group which ended up costing the PDIC aroud 2 billion pesos). That is why Bush has not signed onto the International Court because of some of the political decisions in trying some individuals.
It is a shame that Smith is still confined to his cell/room at the Embassy and though it is very doubtful his conviction will be upheld by the appeals and/or the supreme court. That Suzette is still found in high esteem by many in the opposition and the leftists, shows how political viewpoints will and does color any objectivity that these people have. I hope the court of appeals will overturn the conviction and allow Smith to gain his freedom and clear his reputation. I hope Suzette will be recognized for who she is. A young lady who got drunk and had sex with an American and who claimed she was raped to cover her emberassment that night. That her case was highjacked by leftists who had their own objectives. In the end with her recanting what happened that night it was the leftists who took advantage of her.
by the way, bob, you and the rest of the readers may be interested in Manuel L. Quezon III's article regarding this topic.
it doesn't even support my opinions here and may even strengthen yours… so i'm not trying to force a point.
just a well-worded article that may succinctly explain another perspective of this messy tale.
http://www.quezon.ph/2630/the-long-view-victim-of…
Bob, I am glad that you "tackled" this very hot topic. I didn't think you would do it as to me (MHO)it seems that you always take the "safe road" when addressing things concerning the subject of Philippine politics. Bravo for you!
I have lived in the Philippines since 1995 and after one bad marriage (which I ended with a divorce in Guam) I am married to a woman I can really trust 100%. Having lived in 17 countries, I have learned through hard lessons that is it smart to live a live abroad in a "low profile" mode. In the Philippines you would want to expand that mode by a 1000%. Show me a foreigner that says he doesn't silently fear personal injustice in this country and I will show you a lier. When you leave the USA or other free nations and come here to live; you loose the safety of your freedoms and equal justice. There is absolutely no justice in this country and especially for foreigners. Foreigners are simply "blank checks" waiting to be filled out. You might ask then "Why do you live here with those thoughts?" I live here because I can see beyond all of that and realize that this is a beautiful country with a decent people. I live here becaus I love my wife and children and they are most happy here. AND I would be a lier if I didn't add it is cheaper to live here. I have always said that this is not a poor country but a rich country that has been exploited by a handful of its own people. Look, Daniel Smith was a "dumbass" doing what dumbass young guys do- looking for sex. He made the choice to be in that bar. The larger question is why did Suzette travel all the way up to Subic at that time? Simple, because there were a whole new group of US servicemen there. There were early reports in the case where she said that she was having problems with her boyfriend in committing to getting married. She needed to find anothe "source" to get her "ticket" to the USA. That is an age old story in the Philippines. Bottom line: this whole situation was not about Smith and Suzette- it was international and domestic Philippine politics.It remains the same today. My friends in the US have a very low regard for Filipinos. They see them like little children who want everything in the "toy store" but do not want to pay for it. When they don't get their way they kick and cry. Answer me this question: WHy is it that every rich Filipino, politican,entertainer,high ranking military officer has either a US Visa for US Passport. Look at this General Garcia case-why does his wife and kids have US Citizenship and how can he serve as an officer when it is against both US and Philippine law on the issue of citizenship. IN closing, we know that the Philippine government is corrupt but in all fairness the US government is also corrupt in the way it handles it foreign affairs.P.S. If I wanted to bring my family to the States, it would take about 18-24 months (current time) and I would have to prove financial requirements to get it approved. ANd that is after serving 21 in service to my country. Now this "little bi**h get a free ride to the USA in a matter of weeks. Can anyone explain the justice in that???
I am married to a woman from the Philippines, so I do have an interest in this story.
Probably as a world news event this won't get a lot of press. However this won't be a big tourist boom for people that do vacation or visit the Philippines.
Danny
Bob, Two final thoughts on this discussion:
1. The problem of the VFA is a simple solution. I may not be the "smartest cookie in the jar" but here is my solution. The USA and the Philippines agreed to having a special court (in both countries) that has a US judge and a Philippine judge PLUS a third judge from a agreed upon neutral country to judge cases against American service members in the Philippines and cases against Philippine service members in the USA. When there is a tie vote on a case the 3rd judge steps in the voting process. When there is detention or imprisonment the jail standards in the Philippines must meet the same standards as in the USA. Each side will have the choice of deciding if their person warrants isolation while confine as a safety issue. Each side can request that their service person do their jail sentence in their home countries. Again, the judges will make the decision.The judges would be appointed by their respective Supreme Courts.The 3rd judge would be appoint by the agreement make between the two countries.
2. In the end, Daniel and Suzette committed the same crime and are equally guilty. They failed to show respect to each other as human beings that are seen as equals in the eyes of God. Both are guilty of trying to take advantage of each other.
Thanks Bob, for allowing me to have my say. I enjoy your blog. God Bleas you and yours, John
as for me, i have always doubted her. i don't know why, i just had a feeling.
Bob
Not to take away from YOUR topic here.
"Harry the horse" website from Angeles City. There are always cases to read about that backup the notion that there is NO justice for Kano in the RP.
Bob,
There are problems in the USA too, Sexual Harassment charges. If a woman contacts HR or her employer, the man is guilty until proven innocent. It goes as far as if a man tells a joke and the lady feels offended, that is sexual harassment.
I once worked for a large company, a woman in another division was afraid my position would lower her power, so she would complain about things about me. One time I was called into see the head of HR and was told I touched a woman improperly. It turned out it never happened. The HR manager would not even listen. I finally confronted the accusing woman and found out she never filed the complaint, it was done by her boss, the one that felt threatened by my position.
I even hear years ago when reported that it is ok for a man to say woman looks neat. The man was brought up on sexual harassment, went to court and the judge declared saying a woman looks “neat” was acceptable.
There is also now “date rape” and can be filed years after it happened.
In these situations, it is hard for the man to prove his innocence.
The reason for the clause in the VFA to protect our service members, and yes I am one of those is because it's no secret about the Philippine just injustice system in Luzon. People that live up north know of it quiet well. Just look at the judge who tried the case.
The judge himself was just fired for gross misconduct, gross ignorance of the law or procedure, and gross negligence and inefficiency. Aside from Regional Trial Court branch 73 Judge Renato Dilag, the high court also dismissed his stenographer Concepcion Pascua.
The U.S. government knew the rape charges to be "trumped-up". The woman in question said in open court under oath that it never happened and that it was the Philippine National Police that forced her to file the charge in the first place also the trial transcript will verify that fact!
Originally there were four other Marines accused of the same crime involving the the same woman. Did we all forget about this?? Suzzett works in a bar, ie the same kind in Angeles, she was a bargirl a (registered sex worker) People can say prostitution is illegal in the PI but it's alive and well. The media like to through that fact out as well.
The trial was a complete sham and court was moved from the area the alleged crime took place (Subic Bay) to Manila, for maximum media exposure, greater public reaction and a guaranteed conviction by any and all means necessary!
They even "invented"((quickly passed and made it recto-active)) a law, while the trial was in progress, to convict him because other-wise they would have had to free him for lack of evidence as no rape occurred by the victim's own admission. The invented law said that "A MAN CAN'T HAVE SEX WITH A WOMAN AFTER HE BUY'S HER AN ALCOHOLIC DRINK!
The prejudice directed towards people of other nationalities and the double standards here are outrageous, but it's common place and you either take it or leave the Philippines! Hows this for you a police officer trying to grease some money from you by saying you scooter muffler is to loud. (when your not even on it or have it started) then ask for your keys and revs the thing full throttle to give you a ticket. (stock muffler on a rental scooter) Wanted 1000P to not give a ticket,
I keep the lto fines list with me and showed it to him and said go for he left because he was to lazy to right the ticket.. By the way I had been in the store for over 40 minutes he just saw a target and went for it. You call that a justice system. There is a reason they feel they can get away with that stuff it's because they can.
It's so bad and to the point there is a website dedicated to putting the facts out. I'm not going to put the ling but just look up corruption and Luzon and I'm sure you will find it.
The fact that so much is lost to corruption in the Government there shows that the whole place is corrupt from the top to the bottom. How can they have a fair trial. God help you if you get in a traffic accident and someone is killed your guilty no matter the real facts because face it no local is going to testify on your behalf that is a fact. Seen it been there done that. The pride and prejudice simply will not allow for it. Being set in these ways is also one of the big problems there. It's all about saving face.
If the Philippines had a functional legal system that was not based in corruption, bribes and double dealing it would not be a issue. And my god have you seen some of the jails that people are housed in. You want to talk about human rights abuse, feces covered floors and walls, no toliets, no place to wash up no place to sleep. If the local judicial system will treat it's own like animals then there would be no hope for a non citizen in one of these jails.
Don't get me wrong I still love the RP but I don't like the corruption. There is a reason it's the most corrupt country in Asia.
He was indeed fired Bob I can assure you I'm not here to make things up. This happened this month. Oh yeah he was also tanking bribes, big surprise there.
http://article.wn.com/view/2009/03/06/SC_sacks_or…
I'm a navy Corpsman Bob, I was there in 2005, we did operation enduring freedom Philippines/ and Balikatan Balikatan. She worked at the Neptune club not a patron of the bar ( She is what you call a GRO), Trust me when I say this it's was bar just like Angles city has a new name same old place. locals do not go there the place of for foreigners. The PI media just happen to keep that part under cover but it is a fact.
Her boyfriend and now Fiancee then Lcpl Brian Goodrich 10TH marines out of Okinawa at the time now at Camp Pendleton. (life is going to be hell for this marines when the rest of his unit finds out which won't take long) was also there during this time, were do you think he meet her at in the first place guys?? How is the media going to have the poster child of rape be a bargirl easy they just hide the facts.
Old Goodrich and her already had a on going relationship from when he was there from the last joint exercise. Chris Mills who she claimed invited her to the club is a lie. Mills, HM3 Mills at the time also a navy Corpsman did no such thing, you can't be invited to your job that's just stupid. Even in her recant she slides around this major fact never admitting to it. The press can't say anything about it, to much tourism at risk, Do you think they would put it if she work in Angeles city at a bar either? Let us get this strait your going to work at your parents for 120P a day or making 1000P to 2000P at a bar when military is in town. You should see how man flock to that place when the exercises are going on.
The reason Old Lcpl Goodrich was not in Subic is because they were not allowed to go out in town or out of town during the exercise the rules were clear (no alcohol/no local nationals in your room/ no going out in town)This is what we were order. He was was on Clark at with his unit staying at the Fontana resort villas, Myself stayed at the Holiday inn for over 6 months during my deployment. Did sickcall for these guys so I'm very familar with the timeline.
The simple fact that the whole point she was a (GRO) at a bar and was as they call it barfined just to save face and not let the rest of world know how prostitution can be illegal but legal at the same time show the system as a hole is corrupt. I'm not the average Joe and had boots on ground at the time.
Now if you remember all 4 marines were charged with rape and they threw the driver under the bus in the mess as well. They even denied the driver the right to testify in court. she accused them all of raping her then it went down to just Smith. Trust me when I say I'm severely familiar with the case because we were on the lockdown after it happened and had class and meeting after meeting.
The fact you can accuse 4 people of raping you then all of a sudden it's just one guy should be pause for reasonable doubt. Lance Corporals Keith Silkwood and Dominic Duplantis and Staff Sergeant Chad Carpentier were the others in the van, She changed her story to they were cheering Smith on instead of raping her.
Now can anyone explain how the other three were cleared of cheering on Smith if a rape in a Starex van. Ohh now there is no cheering on and nobody was paying attention to it?? oh was that because Marines are not all a bunch of filthy animals who cheer this own and like to watch there buddies. Oh wait it's because it was two adults doing there thing in the back of the Starex?
The court came up with it's own little law during the proceding stating if a women had been drinking then you could not have sex because her mental faculties were not all there. Also easily pulled up on google.
(Justice Secretary Gonzalez further stated that he should have granted Suzette's wish to remove the "meaty" portions of her affidavit in 2005 when she filed the rape case against Smith. He also added that if he helped her in removing those portions, there "never" would have been a case)
She did not allow for her to tell the truth in the matter that's justice for you.
Sorry for the rant but this is a case that truly gets under my skin. Good luck with the new fiance' Goodrich lol.
Take my statements with your own scrutiny but these are the facts as I know them.
i was there in the philippines when the verdict of the trial went down. she was a bar girl and what would you call a hooker an angel? she was a puta (whore) ! alot of that goes on in the philippines, my friend was dating this woman in cebu and they stay together for 3 weeks . my friend left her and moved to a hotel because the girl was to pushy and demanding and jealous !when it was time to go home and board his plane . he was arrested at the airport the girl had told the cops he raped her! she was mad he wasnt going to marry her so she gave false info to the cops it all got cleared up but the same thing could of happen to my buddy as it did the marine! it is such a contradiction on one hand the filipinos are so religious but they have open prostution and there national sport is cock fighting legal abuse of animals!
The American government has a VFA for so many reasons. The protection of the rights of the U.S. service member is only one of them. Can you imagine what would have happened to Smith if the VFA did not exist? Having been an American service member in places like Olongapo I can agree with your reader John that Marines are not boy scouts-that is why they are called Marines. They are young men and they do what young men do all over the world. Do you remember the Duke Lacrosse team incident? I have told countless Marines to be careful because they are targets for these scams. It is however not just Marines-its all males that visit or live in countries like the Philippines or in the case of the Duke athletes males anywhere. This Nicole girl was manipulated by larger forces than we will ever know. I keep reading about Mayor Duerte wanting to change the VFA-why is he so vocal about this? He is in reality just a mayor of a city. I would assume he should be more worried about traffic and water than international treaties involving the military. What is his agenda here? I suggest that whoever wants the U.S. military presence completely out of the Philippines is behind this entire manipulation of Nicole. If they ever have their way then what will you have? For those living on the island of Mindanao I think we all know the potential answer.
There will always be questions to this story. 1st, was there rape or not ? If there was, why the change of story now ? It could be that the said by onlookers that the settlement had something ot do with it. It could also be said that the Woman has always blamed herself for somehow allowing it to happen. Being in a bar and drinking.
#2. There was no rape. Answers could include that she was drunk and consented. Then after sobering up, felt she was taken advantage of. Friends/family demanded that rape did occur, and maybe, just maybe compensation was required. Then later a feeling of guilt overtook her.
#3 There could also be some pressure, reward or other coming from inside the US. Government or prisoner's family ? These are by no way accusations, only possibilities.
All we can do now Bob is wait and see how it pans out for Smith, the VFA, and to see if justice is served. I pray that it is.
A very entertaining topic Sir BoB. A winner.
The truth lies or lays ( no puns intended ) between the marine and the girl. The whole scenario smacks of a Kangaroo Court.
A foreigner getting justice? If you don't have a whole lot of cash or influential friends, my advice mack, keep outta trouble and choose your girl friends wisely.
Well well well we learn even more of how the justice system work in the RP. http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=45…
Obviously this story generates a lot of passion from both Filipinos and non – Filipinos . Unfortunately it seems both Mr Smith and Ms Nicolas became pawns in a larger stakes poker game , that of politics .
As an American i can say with no shame that there are many things America does politically that i would not agree with . And as an American i only have one voice , when i vote .
Since i have resided in this country i have always been aware of certain elements within Philippine society that aim to rid the Philippines of any and all foreign influence though that is of course impractical .
When i lived near Clark in 2001 i used to engage with some of the protesters shipped into Angeles via bus from Manila . They walked around carrying their " go home Yankee " placards while in many cases wearing a pair of Levis on their butt . Why ? Simple , because they got a free lunch and were paid about $ 5 to do so .
I do have a hard time understanding the agenda of the various power groups wanting the foreign influence to just disappear . If that were to happen who would suffer ? Certainly not the US by any measure . Besides , if not for the American service men who would rebuild the roads , bridges and schools of war torn Mindanao ?
I once spent several hours in conservation with a young Filipino gentleman on board a ship bound for Sabah , Malayasia . I still remember him telling me that to him the biggest problem in the Philippines outside of corruption was that the Filipino had to much freedom . Years later i still think of that conservation at times and wonder if what he meant was the Filipina wants the freedom but not the responsibility that freedom requires .
Hey, this stuff happens here in the USA too! Remember this one – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Duke_University… , and how the power-hungry prosecutor made a mess of it?
In that case, the truth eventually came out. Maybe the same will happen here.
Alan Dershowitz, (sp?), one of our more famous slimy lawyers, (yeah I know ….. "slimy" lawyer is usually redundant!), is credited with saying, "Rape is the most under-reported crime, and also the most over-reported crime."
It's a sad thing and it sucks to be the real victim here, Daniel Smith.
At least Americans aren't out protesting calling for Filipinos to get out of the US, wanting to end all agreements and generally acting like the Manila leftists.
Hey you all,
Wow! isn't this a great topic to discuss? i see a lot of people here that i have never seen before. i am just an observer. it is very interesting and complex topic. I am actually just scanning all of the back and forth discussions and issues of the matter. Thanks Bob for this site, it helps people like me to grasp what is going on there.
good day people…keep the conversation going, it is good for the spirit and it keeps our brain working. 🙂
Hi The Countess – I'm not sure I understand the moral of your story, but thanks for stopping by and commenting!
Hi roy – Very true. I know that a lot of Americans are quite upset that the girl is in the US now.
"The moral of the story" meaning be careful who you're gonna lay with. Sleeping with someone young, attractive and innocent looking doesn't mean everything will be honky-dory after. The younger and prettier, more reason to be cautious especially if picked-up from a bar or club, no matter how classy a club is. Interesting to read other people's comments, including from other ladies. I must say Nicole/Suzette is not getting much sympathy from here. Bilal's comments gave us more insight into the story. Thanks Bilal….
Hi The Countress – OK, got you now. Thanks for clarifying.
Hi Ahmed – Typical attitude… "hey foreigners… if you don't like the injustice, just stay home!" The thing that I find really funny is that when a Filipino OFW abroad gets into legal problems, the entire country cries out to help the Filipino!
Bob,
I am marred to Filipino wife from Calinan, Davao, we love each other so much we have baby girl already. My join me here in my country Oman, after my retirement I am planning to settle down in Davao. Here in my country I own house free from mortgage, Bob what is you suggestion, to move to Davao after my retirement or to stay here..
Though all this scarring news I am really confuse reason I like Davao so much.
I will be there first week of May, hope we meet again. I will be stay in Calinan, Lantaw Bukid resort, Would like you to visist me and we can have Lunch or Dinner together. Family will have family reunion on May three if you will have spare time you are invited. Hope you will provide me direction before I decided to move once for all.
Ahmed
The whole sorry mess gave a bunch of so called nationalist politicians a chance to do some grandstanding – Just as they turned down a new bases agreement in the 90s and put thousands out of work then said they didnt think the Americans would really leave!!
Yes it is funny an sad …You know what they say about PHD's .. The smarter they look the dumber they seem ? .. and I have meet some real dumb ones in my time .." a fool an his money are soon departed ".. humm wonder why ..? … If he is in custody , Why was she alowed to leave the country ..?? Inquiring minds what to know .. pjil
Using the word justice or anything synonymous in describing the local legal system is a bit of a stretch; even the locals know that, as well as those of us who have lived here for more than a few months. Our embassy staff and the USMC also knew how "things work" before any of this happened to Smith and the others. That our people allowed this to play out instead of paying up means that ALL the blame goes on them. I hope everyone has learned their lesson, but I doubt it. Boys will be boys.
Hello PhilippinesPhil – Welcome to my site. Thanks for sharing your opinion. Note that in the title I specifically did not use the word justice… I used "injustice" because it is mor appropriate.
Hello Roger – There has never been any proof that Suzette is a prostitute. I am against what Suzette did, but I do not believe her to be a prostitute.
i honestly dnt believe from what she said.if she really got raped she shouldnt be there in a 1st place.that place is full of predator and hustler looking for a prey!poor smith…..well hey to those left wing politics in the philippines you can fool them but you cant fool me.and by the way wer is she now?there in the U.S not a good place for her to create a drama,so many bar's and club my advice for her dnt get wasted and start a drama your not in your country anymore.
Hi OreoCookies – It will certainly be interesting to see how Suzette's life goes in the States. Probably we will never hear, though.
Bob,
From a woman's perpective i feel less sympathy for Nichole, any woman in her right mind will never go w/ any strangers in the van, what is she doing there in the first place? It was obvious that she's lying since then and to recant her statement only proved that her crediblity down to zero level and it's sad to say that phil. justice sucks but it's true, what i don't understand is this activists keep showing how they dislike the US but they love almost everything about the US…… i don't think Phils will survived if ever the US cut any diplomatic ties w/ the Phils….. i don't think these activists or these minority groups who bluntly show their hatred and dislike to the US can do anything to improved the economic situation of the Phils, they're just a bunch of hypocrites who only have only their own personal political interest…and that sucks too…..
Hi Wildcat – Thanks for sharing your view. I just don't know what to think about the whole thing, but it's all been resolved now. I'm glad that it's over and we can all move on!