A subject that interests me is the modern day concept of ‘rules’ and the way we deal with them. I guess part of my outlook is shaped by the fact I spent so many years with the military,where you don’t ask why, you do.
A day or so back Bob pointed me to a humorous but also slightly troubling post of a blogger he and I both often read, Market Man Manila. The gist of the story is, Market Man (MM) went to the supermarket to buy some groceries and started his shopping with one of those express lane hand baskets. When he was ready to check out, the special hand basket lanes were all backed up but several of the regular ‘silver’ shopping cart check stands were open, so MM marched up to one of those empty lanes and was told that since he had a hand basket he would have to fall in line in the hand basket lane. “Why”? “It’s the rule, sir.”
Now certainly on the face of things that seems a stupid rule. I won’t argue ‘for’ the rule for a minute … were it my store, I’d abolish the rule instantly. But as the clerk tried to explain … as one of the lowest level employees in the place, she had been instructed to follow the rules, under penalty of termination … period.
Again, the logic behind the rule escapes me … but the logic of keeping a paying job in a country hobbled by massive unemployment and poverty does not escape me … maybe a lot of people out there were born a colonel or some such rank and never made their way up from E1 trying to raise a family on a pittance, outranked by everyone they see. It’s pretty easy to berate low-level staff who might be worrying about feeding their kids when you have a good paying job and money in your pocket.
MM went on in his often humorous but also somewhat bitter and demeaning style to relate for several paragraphs how he essentially considered this employee dumb because she could not explain why the store had the rule, and when a supervisor was eventually produced, the she too could not explain why the rule was in place.
Quite frankly I think the story was a bit disingenuous … the way the problem was finally resolved was that MM got a regular ‘silver’ cart, transferred his groceries to that and left the store, original mission accomplished. Rule or no rule, this is the way I shop often … thinking I need only a few items, then transferring to a regular cart when I discover I really need more … I learned the transfer trick from just watching other shoppers, MM has lived here all his life, I can’t believe this technique wasn’t familiar to him as a matter of course. This story is similar to a lot of expat stories I hear, when at the end, one has to wonder was the person’s original intent to buy groceries or to waste a lot of time and emotional energy in proving (to someone, maybe himself) just how smart or important he is. The fastest way to get through the day, in my book, is to keep your eye on the prize … I really don’t care who thinks I’m smart or who thinks they ‘got over on me’ as long as have my groceries in hand and am headed home …
The comments to MM’s post are quite extensive, many from other Filipinos and almost overwhelming agreeing with the tone that suggests the lowest paid employees in the store are ‘dumb’ because they can’t rattle off not only what the rules are, but an explanation of the rules. Seems a bit much to me. In the military we would have said, “the reason for that rule is above my pay grade, sir.”
MM, for personal reasons keeps his true identity private, but I believe he is a high level executive for a company in the financial field. Banking and finance are just full of rules like the hand basket/silver basket issue that caused MM’s heartburn. Even though he’s a senior executive, not a low-level work for wages employee, I’d make a bet I could walk into his office, read a few memos and company manuals and in only a few minutes find some ‘rule’ that he himself would have trouble enunciating an explanation for, contemporaneously, on his feet with someone obviously angry sticking his nose in his face and demanding a fast response.
I really think that every one of use operates inside a set of rules every day that we can’t come up with an instant explanation for … even the ones we like we can’t always explain. Why does the bank insist you endorse a check in a certain way. Why does McDonald’s stop serving certain items at 11 am when many other dining establishments have breakfast all day long? The list could go on, but I think my point is clear … there’s a corporate or government reason behind every one of those rules, but how many of us are prepared to give an impromptu explanation?
Would you feel good about yourself if you went into a McDonald’s at 11:01 am, ordered a breakfast item, get told that breakfast hours were over, and then spent who knows how many minutes of your precious time demanding the 16yo at the counter on her very first job explain the rule?
Frankly, I’d feel kind of embarrassed and sad after I came down off my high horse … almost like a bully you might say. Their counter girl in McDonald’s and the checkout girl in the SM Supermarket didn’t make the rule and neither one has any idea of what corporate level decision went in to deciding ‘cut off hot cakes at a certain hour or serve them all day?’ ‘Checkout all types of baskets at a certain checkout, or restrict to certain ones for certain checkouts?’
Why would the rank and file be expected to discourse on the reasons for the rules, when they get paid a pittance to wear a silly uniform and accept whatever comments and criticisms a customer wants to sling their way?
Seems a bit unrealistic to me ..what do you think?
I have found in my work for over 30 years serving the public. That the customer is not always right, and most times is usually wrong, because of the lack of knowledge. My motto, and not J.C. Penny himself, is the customer needs to be educated. Penny’s motto allows customers to become abusive.
It is not because they feel superior that they are abusive, but because they have a very low self esteem. There fore they have to belittle, and abuse those that are helpless to help make themselves feel important. Inside these people are weak, and full of fear. When I am the customer I am patient with clerks. I know their job is not an easy one……i2f….John
Hi Dave,I feel that the employees don't make the rules, and it's only right, and makes it easier all around to go with the flow, be respectful and follow them, whether or not they seem reasonable. I used to read MM blog all the time, because I love the cooking stuff, but one day I just had to stop cold-turkey, because he is so arrogant and he thinks he's just God's gift. I swear he has only relatives, friends and business associates responding to his articles, because most regular Filipinos and foreigners would never conduct themselves with such a superior attitude.
An excellent article! MM's attitude is deplorable. He represents the kind of rich, prejudiced Filipino who treats people of 'low status' like dirt, rubbing their noses in their powerlessness. You are promoting a contrasting attitude which will make a big difference for both customers and the beleagered underlings alike. Thanks for pointing out this problem and suggesting kindness, patience and practical common sense.
Thank you Dave for this wonderful article. What a surprise–I kind of thought what it was all about & I was wrong. What's more is that ieaves me re-examine the way I conduct myself in public. Common sense may dictate that any cashier who's not busy should help anyone who's on queue. But that is not the point of the article, at least on how I read it.
My only question is & this goes to Queeniebee as well–who is "MM"? I'm curious now w/ his blog.
Hello Dave,
A great article again, and not a subject just for the Philippines. I have worked in retail here in the USA for many years now. Dealing with the public is not always easy, and that old golden rule "The customer is always right", is a hard one to stomach sometimes. No matter how smooth your operation is, and "most of the time isn't", there's always those customers you can't satisfy.
The companies I have worked for usually deal in large volumes, big box supermarkets and general merchandise outlets. Dealing with literally thousands of customers each day. Of course these companies, have rules, many rules, and we do the best to utilize them, so the customer will have a "great shopping experience", and of course "return and spend more money".
Even at Walmart, where we were usually understaffed, at the checkout/cashier registers, and throughout the store. We always had those customers who thought they were Gods gift to the world and expected answers to each and every problem. Most of the time, answers that couldn't be answered by our corporate offices in Bentonville, Arkansas. Walmarts answer to this problem is "Please maam/sir, accept this $20 gift card as a resolution to your bad experience shopping with us at Walmart. (I wish I had all the $20 gift cards they have given away free, I would be a very rich man).
But back to the "gist" of your article, why do these people go in and treat these employees like they do, because they feel "superior" to them. I will never be able to answer that question, because I have never been that type of person. I have seen this happen many times in my years, and as a manager dealt with these people.
There will always be people we can't satisfy, and there will always be those people who want to make life more difficult than is necessary. So for me I try my best to worry about my actions, not much we can do about those that don't care who they hurt or belittle.
Thanks,
Danny
Dave:
Thank you for another great and, I might add, thought provoking article. It bothers me when people take out their frustrtions out on low level employees who have to live by the rules and are powerless to change them. You did a mravelous job pointing out the fallacy behind this practice.
The first thing that came to my mind when MM discovered the clerk could only serve people with carts was – grab a cart. I can't help but wonder who the mentally challenged one is in this example. Is it the clerk who has to obey the rules or risk termination or the smartalec shopper who merely has to transfer his goods to a cart to get served quicker?
Most employees here in the Phil. for fear of losing their precious job would follow the 'rules' to the letter regardless of the situation and sometimes even if there's no sense at all. It's almost like giving precise instructions to robots and you'll expect them to be followed.
So a typical customer who were used to the 'customer is always right' treatment and other customer-friendly businesses will find it odd and frustrating and would often think that these low-life employees may not have any intelligence at all cause all sense and logic seems to have disappeared. But a simple logic of being fired and thus losing their only means of earning a living should put it in the right perspective.
Hi Roy, I would have thought being a Manileno you would have heard of this blog! It's Market Manila/MarketMan. I used to love reading it because I'm really into Philippine food and cooking and it gave me a window into Manila and some of Cebu. I just got fed up eventually because he's just so elitist, rude and full of himself, that it made reading it upsetting to me. So much kissing-up by readers' too!
Yes, I used to be an avid reader too, but he turned me off sometime back becuase his attitude reminds me too much of the "Ugly American" type … regardless sof the color of his passport. When I was a boy I used to spend a lot of time at a small airport which had a crowd of well to do customers (people with private airlanes tend to be a bit richer thna most).
It's not as easy as some would thing to 'wear' wealth graciously. Even as boy it was very clear to me which clients were truly wealthy and which ones had a little success in life and desparetley wanted the world to know how self-important they were.
After a few years there it was as if the two categories of folks wore different color shirts, the differences in attitude, and especially how they treated service personnel, were strikigly different.
So true, AM, so true. There are a lot of my fellow foreigners here in the Philippines who seem to delight in bullying lesser people (becuase they typiclaly get away with it, i suppose), but they are not alone, to be sure … it's a trait shared by a number of Filipinos as well.
An interesting aside/update on this. In the weeks since this big dust up ensued, I now notice that in my local SM Hypermarket, someone had to print up and install "Big Basket" signs on all the regular checkout lanes. Of course, every expense like this is paid for, in the end, by the consumer, so thanks, MM, for driving up my grocery bill a few more pesos. I'll think of you every time I see the new signs.
Hi Roy, thanks for the kind words. The link to the original article and likely everything you want to know about Market Man Manila is right there in the link to the original article (paragraph 2, line 2).
Well put, Danny. The part that seemed most incongruous was not the bullying attitude … that, sadly, is very common. It's that the original author, and surprisingly many of his comments, were incensed that the clerk could not recite chapter and verse the _reason_ for the rule.
That part really stuck in my craw. I served 38 years in the US military and if there is ever a contest for 'organizations with the silliest rules' … MM's headline which started this discussion … the US military has to at least be in the final 4 ;-). In nearly 4 decades I was called on the carpet many times for many infractions of this, that or the other rule, but I am darned if I can remember a single time I was chewed out for not knowing the _reason_ for a rule.
To be a good little soldier or a good little sales clerk you need to follow rules, it's unrealistic to demand that you recite the 'reason' for them. At that level of responsibility (and pay), as I was told many times, "You're not paid to think"
Thanks, David. yees, as I mentioned, I learned long ago … by watching the Filipinos shopping in the same supermarket … how to shop with a hand basket and then put the goods in a big silver basket if the hand basket lkanes were clogged up. It's sort of like following the crowd, or 'when in Rome …'
If I didn't know better I would have read that article and thought the author was a chauvinistic foreigner who couldn't be bothered to be aware of his own surroundings. Made me want to start writing a novel, actually, "Up The Down Staircase". (oops, that title is already taken LoL)
Sound advice, indeed. As you say, John, I often wonder about the self esteem of people who seem to be compelled to belittle others 'because they can'. Having been in the 'operating from anger' mode a few times in my life, I can heartily recommend getting out of it and staying out of it.
No matter how 'right' you may be, it's really impossible to truly make yourself feel good by making someone else feel bad. The beauty of 'feeling good' is, it is not a zero sum game … one doesn't have to lose for the other to win.
Hi Dave,
I know what you mean, my father spent nearly 40 years with the US Air Force, mostly with Air Force One. I spent many years working on military installations, and also got to know a "little" about that myself.
I know what you meant and the subject of your article, but like I said, I have seen that in the USA as well. It all comes down, to "not giving the customer the right answer" so anything you say, especially if you tell them, "I am not sure why that rule is, Sir". They don't care, they just want satisfaction, and at that moment for some reason, they think they are "king of the world". In the few years I worked as management for Walmart, Inc. I could probably write a book on the experiences from customers, and there expectations, demands, and just outrageous suggestions.
One thing I did enjoy, the store manager at one of the locations I worked at, it was such a high volume of customers each day. On a slow day we had well over 4-5000 people come through our doors. As soon as any profanity came out of that customers mouth, and any disrespectful attitudes, they were ask to leave very politely, or if not, escourted by our security or the good ole West Palm Beach Police Dept.
Also real quick, someone said that this happens because the person is not arrogant, but has low self esteem, that may be true in some cases, but I think of it as arrogance myself, some of the people expect a certain level of efficiency they are use to, and expect that in all certain aspects of there lives, even with the filipino cashier who makes maybe 80-100 peso's a day.
Salamat,
Danny 🙂
Exactly, Bad. There are too many frustrated prize fighters out there who can't seem to resist beating up on those who have no means to fight back.
Funny thing about those rules, too. They sometimes have a purpose. I was handing in a form at my bank and the teller hand it back and told me I had to copy the same information onto another section of the form. I was tired and impatient and I snapped back at her, "Since you want the information there, you copy it."
It just struck me as kind of lazy and officious on her part that after painstakingly checking the form and finding the missing info she wouldn't just, as good customer service, go ahead and copy in the information … saving us both time.
The teller looked very unhappy and scared and pointed with her eyes and lips toward a security camera. "Sir, I can not touch a pen to that form, I would be instantly fired if 'they' saw me."
So I sighed and filled in the data, got the transaction finished and left the counter. My bank manager keeps his ddeak out in the lobby, in the open, accessible to everyone who wanders by, and I frequently stop and chat with him.
Still a bit miffed by this perceived laziness on the teller's part, I stopped to chat with Mr. Favro (Nards is his nickname, same as my father-in-law). Luckily, as it turns out, I didn't bring the matter upo directly as a complaint, but after some other conversation worked in a question about making it easier on the cutomer by filling up repetitive forms for them. His reply really shocked me … "oh we have had to cut out all of that as part of the main office's anti-fraud programs. The tellers are watched continuously by home office security, and if they are seen filling up a customer's form, it's instant termination … and a reprimand for me."
Remember Gilda Radner's character on SNL, Rosana Dana Dana, the one who used to get everything wrong and then brush it off with a "Never mind". Boy did I have the wrong concept. I excused myself from my conversation with Mr. Favro and as I left his desk I saw the teller watching me, a troubled look on her face … I'm sure she thought I went over there to pound the desk and complain about her. Leaving the bank the guard opened the door for me, but he didn't need to, I felt low enough to just slide under the door.
For all MM knows, there could have been a camera watching the lady in the supermarket, or some other rel threat to her job. It just doesn't pay to fly off the handle like that, as John also pointed out, the customer may not always be right, and when you buly someone who isn't able to respond you really don't win, you only show yourself as a loser.
Ha ha you made me laugh there, Danny. You said a mouthful when you mentioned West Palm Beach. One of the reasons I am retired in the Philippines is that an alternative would be Florida, and I can't stand to be associated with the retirement community in Florida. Talk about petty people trying to act out a 'big role' during their sunset years … not my lifestyle. Same reason I won't join the AARP .. I am turned off by their 'pander to me, I Old, So I Am Entitled attitude. Spare me, please.
Hello Dave,
I am glad I gave you a little chuckle this morning, I agree, we have some very colorful retirees in this area, and have a distinct way of expressing themselves.
I also agree with you about that environment, is another reason for wanting a different location, and culture to absorb myself into.
Thanks again,
Danny 🙂
Hi Queeniebee, it's my first time to read MM's blog and I can't put a face on his blog. That does not inspire credibility for me.
But Dave & Queeniebee, let's agree that MM made valid points. He thinks it' stupid– & rightly so– that the cart or the basket you're holding (& never the amount of items) determines your lane for your check out counter. & what makes it even more silly is you will not get any service if you do not follow that rule, never mind if the cashier involved is not doing anything.
It's still not a terrible thing to do to if he asked the cashier the wisdom of that rule. We all want to be enlightened. I would ask that question. But the moment, I cannot extract valid answer from the cashier, I would call the manager. I might even write them a complaint letter & see if that works.
SM is notorious for its questionable labor practices, i.e., hiring employees only if they belong to a certain religious group, requiring ladies to put wear open-toed shoes etc.
By the way, would you have reacted differently if this meltdown is perpetuated by the more assertive Americans?
HI Roy and yes you and MM are right to ask for the reason for this rule, but from the right personnel. The lowly cashier is only there to tell you how much your grocery checkout bill is not to quote corporate policy maybe Mr SM himself would say, because it's my store and that's my rule live with it or shop somewhere else, then what ? i believe Dave's message here isn't the question or policy but who should have the decency to determine who should be accountable to answer policy questions from the corporate level do you know why it's illegal to take photo's at the embassy ? and if you don't does that make you stupid ? i believe that's Dave's point 😉
Roy, this event could have just as easily happened in the US as in the Philippines. I don't know why you want to bring nationality into it. But since you asked the question, I would have been even more appalled and embarrassed had the bully been US rather thna Filipino, to be honest.
Dave, I do not read that particular blog any more.
Personally I think the guy should lighten up.
I was told by someone a long time ago that you can really take the measure of a man by how he treats wait staff (or in this case the Cashier).
Best
Joe
That statement about the measure of a man is so true. The same can be said about how a man treats women as well.
As far as Market Man, indeed he should really lighten up. Actually, based on some people I know who know him, he's really not such a nasty person as he came across in his article … but you know stress is a number one cause of heart disease, high blood and any number of other diseases … and if you are going to get so wrapped around the axle over an incident so picayune, it doesn't bode well for bouncing your grandchildren on your knee.
The rlke is stuoid, I don't dispute that, and even if the store help has been rude, so freeaking what? Shake it off and move on to more pleasant things, you'll live longer.
That's the message I tied to get across in my last article here … so many people work themselves into a virtual or even literal frenzy over politics, economics, world events, Illegal immigrants, Cebu pacific carry on bag rules or taxi drivers who hold out their hand for a tip.
The world has always had problems, everything from literally earth shaking problems to rude taxi drivers … so what? I have it on pretty good authority that no one in this group will ever solve any of those problems, and the rule I learned in school is that if you want to do as well as you can on an exam, skip the problems you know you can't solve and move on to the ones you can answer.
Life is just one big exam, after all, keep answering questions correctly, you keep gettng more to answer … quit and you're pushing up daises…
Hi Queeniebee, like I said, I've never heard of MM simply because his lack of photo, name does not inspire any credibility for me. Usually, I read blogs that I came upon through media sources that I can also see in print. That said, if you are interested in Phil cooking, MM's blog is not a good source. Michaela Fenix of inq7.net or phil. daily inquirer is an excellent source of literature about Philippine food. She may not write on the exact ingredients but the experience of eating the food–how to get there, with local color thrown in good measure– captures the essence of Phil food as it relates to its local people. The great thing about this food writer is she replies to your emails.
From the little that I've read about MM's blog, I would think that he writes more about food not consumed by about 80% of Fili population like foie gras etc.
I remembered in an episode of Anthony Bourdain-No Reservations (Travel Channel) where he was featured, MM mentioned that he spent 20 some odd years in Boston. His feature on "Bourdain" was his crowning glory. You can check him out on Travel Channel website, he has a behind-the-scenes picture on the Philippines episode, there's also a video of the episode.
Or you could go direct to the source … http://www.unoficialcook.com While it is true my opinion is biased, I have the waistline to prove she knows her business.
Hi Dave.
Thanks for the article and link to the Blog. I wanted to read the "his" side of the story.
So, Mr. Elitist Grocery Shopper believed everyone in line before him overlooked an empty check-out lane and the clouds parted as a shining light lit a path to the register just for him?
In his words: "As almost always happens, I rapidly filled up both baskets to the brim with groceries, and just as they were about to fall out, decided we should check out."
If that was the case, shouldn't he "almost always" remind himself to get a larger basket when shopping for groceries?
The real problem was nothing more than a bruised ego. A clerk he presumed to be powerless and beneath him actually proved to be "the authority" and he could not accept it.
In the time it took to embarrass himself, Mr. Elitist Grocery Shopper could have checked out as everyone before him and moved on with his day.
How about his post scriptum! What a tool.
Junior
Hi Dave,quite frankly, I would think that this would not be much of an issue when done by americans who are engineered to say what's on their minds. While a Filipino who asserts himself (totally against the Filipino archetype of timid, easy & smiles at anything)is called arrogant, a bully.
Hi Roy,
Well this is one of those deals where neither of us is 'right' or 'wrong', but 'asserting' one's self has diferent meanings to different people. Assertion snd aggression are two different things.
I have no problem with attempting to show the sales help a better way .. but the whole thrust of MM's article seemed to be that
a., the SM rule is stupid (which I personally agree with) and
b., that the cleak was stupid or at least uncaring when she couldn't 'explain' the rule.
That I think is wrong thinking from anyone, American, Filipino or any other nationality.
Somewhat 'stipid' rules exist everywhere, and they can't be changed by low level employees, it's just not fair to expect that of them/
Still seems like bullying to me. To me, 'assertion' would be to politely ask for the manager and explain to the manager why you think the rule is stupid … might even get somewhere with that approach.
Anyway, quite a bit more discussion came out of this little piece than I expected, and like almost always happenes I learned much more from the comments than I ever do from researching/writing the article itself. Thanks for participating.
Yeah he's a hoot, really. It's just not worth getting that worked up for such along time over such an inconsequential thing. And lest's consider the 'dark side'. Suppose the clerk _was_ enforcing the rule because she felt mean and/or didn't like something about MM. We like to expect the best from people but of course sometimes people are doing something for spite. Well the bigger the issue you make and the longer you carry on about it, the more they feel 'they win'. I mean why play into someone's hands that way? Even if you win, you lose, so to speak,
I have been following this discussion with great interest. I've been using the discussion to kind of gauge my feelings about the whole thing. You see, my original reaction to reading Market Man's rant was that he was correct. Perhaps he didn't handle his dealing perfectly, but his gut reaction was that the policy was stupid, and indeed, I believe that it is a stupid policy. I mean, why would it matter what type of shopping cart you are using, if one lane is full and another isn't, well, it makes sense to help the customer.
Now, when I first heard Dave's reaction to this, I was kind of surprised, but I thought about it, and I find myself agreeing that it was not right to berate the clerk about it.
However, there are things in the Philippines which should change, need to change in order to improve the country. Feyma and I often lament that Filipinos need to stand up and be a little more assertive. They need to speak up when something is wrong. MM certainly is an example of somebody who stands up for what he believes. Perhaps he stands a little too tall in exerting his feelings, but that's just MM, I suppose.
So, in general, I feel that if more Filipinos stood up and made their feelings known, better service would happen here. Things would improve. For example, if people don't like corruption in the Govt, well, if they make it known that they won't accept it – that can make for change and improvement. If everybody is just quiet about stuff, nothing will change.
I do think it's possible, though, to speak up, while still honoring those who must enforce policies over which they have no control.
Any thoughts on this?
Hi Dave – I am not sure I understand this:
Do you mean that you agree that the rule is stupid, or that you agree with the rule? I can't totally figure out which you mean.
Hey Bob!
With regard to MM, I have to believe store policies were developed from research to support them. In addition, MM's presumed logic behind an attempt to cut ahead of everyone proved to not only be illogical, it was arrogant. Now, he clearly understands the rules and shares it with his audience. Besides, how long would it take to fill up the lane if an exception was made and how should management handle complaints from shoppers following the rules?
With regard to Filipinos speaking up, as access to education improves, more people understand what's at stake IMHO.
I've been following the Constitution crisis and there's plenty of people openly expressing their concerns on that issue.
http://www.gmanews.tv/story/164803/Chief-Justice-…
Junior
Thanks for the info roy–I'll check that out!
Amen to that Bob! I don't want to be refused service just because I use the basket and not the cart. If I don't cut any lines, don't jump on anyone, the cashier's lane is empty & she's raedy to help on anyone–why can't she help me? Transferring the basket into the cart does not help the situation & would only promote further stupidity. SM should rethink this rule.
hi bob
I will quote you
"
So, in general, I feel that if more Filipinos stood up and made their feelings known, better service would happen here. Things would improve. For example, if people don’t like corruption in the Govt, well, if they make it known that they won’t accept it – that can make for change and improvement. If everybody is just quiet about stuff, nothing will change."
That is what i've been preaching to alot of pinoys i know or pinoys i just met, I don't want to take any more crap from anyone in the philippines, I don't condone bribery, corruption or anything that is not legal.
It happened to me when i was renewing my passport at the philippine consul here, i was standing in line waiting for my turn, then suddenly there's another guy who just went in front of the line and handed his papers, I assumed he knew the person behind the counter, I stepped in and with a very loud voice I told him that there is a line and he must fall in line and wait for his turn, I don't care if he knew the person behind the counter or even if he is the son of the president. I also told him that people like him is one of the main cause of corruption in the country, the next thing I did was, I approach the consul person and complaint about it. long story short, the person behind the counter and the guy were so embarassed and left the building.
Good catch, Bob. The silly thing about this English langauge is, you have to say what you men to say, people can't guess. I'm going to start taking English lessons soon 😉
I mean to say I think the 'big basket only' rule is dumb. If I wre in charge I'd abolish it in a New York Minute.
I also agree fully with your other comment today about Filipinos taking action to change the Philippines. I couldn't get any more in agreement with you on that.
What I do not agree with, ever. is the passive-agressive bullying of MM and suprisingly so many of his readers, both foreign and Filipino. Givinbg a store clerk a hard time over what her manager told her to enforce is typically the act ofd someone who doesn't have the persona; courage to approach even a store manager on their owen … after all that mamager might have a powerful family name ot be a 'bacth mate' of someone important.
Anyway, I can't believe how much ha come out of this little topic, and I have learned athing or three. Thanks for point this out to me and I guess I better give a big tip of the blog hat to Market Man for writing about it in the first place. If he just wrote the story for link bait, it certainly seems to have worked out well for him 😉
Hi roy – I'm with you all the way on this. MM could have been more tactful, but the rule is not only stupid, it's crazy.
Hi dans – In many ways, Filipinos with the kind of attitude that you have don't fit well into society here. I would guess that you can really puzzle people. You are Filipino, yet you think like a foreigner. You're and enigma to people here! I think, though, that the Philippines needs more people like you!
Hi Dave – Ha ha…. Yeah, I am sure that MM got plenty of links from the rant. That's SEO expertise! 😉 Thanks for sharing your side on this. I have mixed feelings. On some things I come down with you, on others I come down with MM. You both have points.
hi bob,
When I was still in the philippines, I thought that the way I do things there are the right thing, I didn't realize I was also part of the problem, I've been living abroad for 18 years now and everytime I look at the philippines externally, I can see the filipino attitude and I sometimes wonder, I was probably doing the same thing when i was there, seeing the philippine externally makes a lot difference towards my attitude. I can see the illness of my people, the wrong and unjust attitude of my countrymen, the magnitude of corruption and all other thing that I despised.
In 5 years time I will be going home for good and I am feeling scared, I am scared because i might not handle the reality of living in the philippines, there are questions at the back of my head and i do not have answer for them, could the philippine change me back to what i was 18 years ago? can i take all the craps the filipino could throw at me? there are so many fears and uncertainty in my head right now.
Hi dans – I will say this… living abroad is a good thing for any person. It opens their eyes so that they can see their country in the true sense of what it is. As you say, it applies to you. It applies to me too. Living outside the USA is something that has changed my outlook forever as well.
I can tell you, moving back will not be an easy thing for you to adjust to. But, you will do it. It takes time, and a relearning of patience! 😯
Yes Bob! I, for one, will never do that. First of all, I really hate calling attention to myself. Second, I would be too dumbstruck to react. Third, I'd pray that someone else who has cojones will pull a stunt like Dans. But if I were refused by a cashier like that in SM, all hell will break loose. 🙂
Hi roy – Ha ha… yeah, I think that the situation at SM when it came to the carts was ridiculous. Problem is that I bet that's a company wide policy, even the manager could not change it.
I think you are right on the company-wide policy, Bob. I may have mentioned already, since MM published his original post I note that in our local SM Hypermarket they now have little graphic signs at each 'big cart' checkstands with a little shopping cart graphic and the worsing 'big cart on;y ort some such. Apaprently this issue has gone somewhere internally withinh the company, or why would the local stire have gone to the trouble to put up these new signs.
Instead of owning up to the fact a policy was silly, they appear to be 'circling the wagons' to make sure the policy gets enforced and a stray hand basket or two doesn't slip past unnoticed. Gosh it is amazing, it really is. Makes me feel like recruiting about 20 people and going to the store some busy day and everyone get a couple items in a hand basket and then all stand in the checkouts at the same time and argue … the manager would faint I think LoL. I muct have climbed out of the 'brigadier' side of the bed this morning 😉
Oh no doubt we are much closer together on this than we are apart. I'm 100% with MM on this, I just was very put off by the 'ugly American' way he, in his own words, said he handled it. What he really ought to do is hire a lawyer .. we both probably know one who would take the case … CV. She already dislikes SM with a passion. Perhaps we could could get one of the 'Presidentables' to take it to the Senate for a week of hearings too … oh, dear I really am bad this morning, aren't I?
I hate to say this but the reason such a rule was put up was to prevent the clogging up of the express lane/hand basket lane. As you all know everybody hates to wait in line so when the regular silver cart lane was full and will take a long time to thin down because logically there were more items in here than in the band baskets, those customers using the silver carts usually come to the express lane thereby denying the very same people to whom those lanes were made for, people with just a few items or do on their baskets. Ihope this clears things up for everyone.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Hi Earnest, thanks for sharing, but sorry guy, I'm not going along with that explanation. What you say makes sense, when and only when the checkstands are manned and full.
This was the situation when the whole issue got started via Market Man's post. Cashiers were standing by, doing nothing, and would not serve him until he transferred the same items to a silver cart … then they promptly did their jobs.
Your explanation would make sense when things are filled up, but the rest of the time, as SM practices the rule, it's just another little example of where the Philippines is indeed, far behind … customer service. Many stores seem to be run by folks who were in the army and couldn't make sergeant, so they got out, frustrated and now operate as if they were the sergeant and the customers are buck privates. If anything ever does convince me to go back to the US, it will be the inadequate and sometimes downright insulting "customer service" so many stores practice. In my opinion anyway.
A few days ago I was in a KFC. I fell in line right behind the only customer ata cash register. Then, ages and ages passed. The customer ahead of me was taking forever becuase he had just bought a large order for his office and the staff had made some mistakes and nobody could figure out how to charge him more for some things that they had neglected to charge for. There were four registers unmanned, all the other were backed up, so nothing to do but wait it out .. happens that way of course in any business. (oh BTW the fellow in front of me was Filipini, this wasn't a language difficulty, it was adifficulty in processing a simple chicken order)
Finally a young lady came to the empty register just next to the one I was at and motioned to me to approach. Thank goodness. I thought, the manager had finally noticed he had 5 or six people making standby while the store had unused registers ands the lines were backing up.
When I stepped up to the new register, guess what the cashier's first words were? "Welcome to KFC, may I take your order."? No. "Sorry for the wait, sir, may I help you'? No. She looked me in the eye and saud 'For a while,sir, then turned her back on me to filled with some chicken boxes that were in disarray on the counter behind her."!
I'm telling you I laughed so hard people looked from all over and I just couldn't resist saying, "Ma'am, I believe my 'for a while" started quite a while ago".
The fellow who had been stalled in front of me all this time, and was still frustrated becuase the store manager was arguing about how his staff never made such a mistake, it was the cutomers fault, just busted up laughing when he heard me.
He turned toward me with a big grin, gave me the 'lips point' toward the recalcitrant manager and just rolled his eyes and laughed some more. He certianly got the joke.
The girl at my register never did figure out why I said what i said or why the other customer thought it was funny, to her, it didn't matyter how long a customer had waited, the correct response was 'for a while'.
You have to let the customer know who is boss. I fully expect some day to have a clerk bark at me, "Drop and give me 10, boy", just like my old, fondly remembered drill instructor, TSgt Clarence D. Marshall, lo those many years ago. RIP, TSgt Marshall, your traditions are being upheld to this day.
Hello. It seems some or many of the commenters have at least some important facts straight. Foremost among them is that I did in fact wait until the supervisor approached the checkout counter and blew my top at her, NOT the cashier. Does it make a difference? In my mind, yes, as the supervisor/manager of the store IS in a position to understand the situation, rules, response better than the cashier. Further, in situation such as these, where I do file a complaint, usually in writing, I do use my full name and give a mailing address. On my blog, I prefer to use the name Marketman for a variety of reasons. However, recently, due to slip ups in televised features, my name has been used in broadcasts. But back to service complaints… I do believe that not enough Filipinos demand good service, and as such, we all end up with the short end of the stick. With nearly 2,200 posts in Marketmanila's archives, it's interesting how a few folks can draw such certain conclusions on what I might be like based on a couple of posts, pissy ones though they may be. For more of a similar vein, check out earlier posts on Ayala Land, Cebu Pacific, Photonapping, Plagiarism and Reggie Aspiras, Shittybank, etc. In ALL CASES, I eventually got to the top management with my written complaints and in EVERY SINGLE ONE they acknowledged the facts of the matter to be accurate, and in a majority of cases, positive changes were made to their operations. I don't just "bitch" for the sake of bitching… The Shitty Market example was one of a few where I didn't bother to write management. But in a similar dopey situation at Rustan's, they actually changed some rules that made it much more consumer friendly. And Dave, if you do know people who know me, then you would have a pretty good picture of what I am like in person. Regards, MM
Pardon me, I meant some of your commenters have the facts "WRONG" not straight…
Dave,
No problem, i just stated how the rule came to be. Just the management didn't figure to explain how to give leeway if the express lane were full and the the cart lane empty. That may be the case why we have horrible customer service here sometimes.
I have skimmed through a few comments here.
One time I had a few items in a basket and was cut off by a woman whose total bill was over a $100.00 (That was 40+ years ago) I would liked to have ripped her a few nice words…but maybe there was an urgent personal matter or maybe felt she was more important. The latter I pity.
Another time the lines were long except the 10 item express checkout. Again cut off by a full cart of groceries, the cashier calmly asked the woman….Which 10 items do you want to purchase? (WONDERFUL)….the rule was 10 items….self explanatory. So we here in the US have the same rules/exceptions as there.