As most of you know, I am taking lessons to learn to speak Bisaya. My lesson is every Wednesday afternoon. Unfortunately, I missed the previous two weeks! I really felt bad about it, but both weeks were beyond my control. Two weeks ago, i was sick that day, and last week, my Mom was leaving on Thursday morning, and we had a lot to do on Wednesday, so I had to cancel my class. So, yesterday, I was a little nervous, and dreading the class, because I felt that I would have fallen behind. You see, not only had I missed my classes, I also did not study a bit for the last two weeks. I was lucky, though, my teacher said that I had done a good job of retaining what I had learned, and should not worry about my absence.
During our class yesterday afternoon, the vocabulary that I was working on lead my teacher (Bebe) and I to a very interesting discussion. One of the words that I had on my vocabulary list was “merkado” which means market. Another word that is more commonly used in my area for market is “palengke.” We talked about the fact that I would be better to use palengke rather than merkado, although it’s good to know both. Previously, I learned the word “tindahan” which means store. Generally, I already understood how merkado or palengke meant a public market or a wet market. If you have spent time in the Philippines, you know what I am talking about – it’s basically an open air market where you can buy meat, vegetables, fish and such. Each vendor has an individual stall, there is not like a “checkout counter” for the entire market. You deal with each vendor individually. This is something I understood already. However, I asked Bebe a few questions that lead to an interesting exchange of ideas and it was very enlightening in a cultural sense for each of us.
Just for curiosity sake, I asked Bebe what the difference was between tindahan and palengke or merkado. She explained to me that a tindahan was more like a sari-sari store. A sari-sari store is basically a little store that is generally in the front yard of somebody’s house, or even built in as part of their house, but has an opening on the street. You can buy things like snacks, basic items like cooking oil, sugar and such, and drinks, even ice at a sari-sari store in most cases. There may be 3 or 4 people on your street who have a little sari-sari store. In general (except in higher class gated communities), I would venture to say that virtually every residential street in the Philippines has at least one sari-sari store. I was a little surprised when Bebe told me that a tindahan was a sari-sari store. I have known the word tindahan for years, and I always thought that any store can be called a tindahan. But, Bebe told me that this is not the case. I asked her, how about a store in a mall, what would it be called? She told me that it is just called “mall.” Hmm… very interesting.
My next line of questioning with Bebe was what the difference was between a market, store and mall to a Filipino. Well, mall is rather obvious to all of us what that is, right? However, I found the understanding of “store” and “market” to be totally different than what I would have expected. A market is, as I understood already, the public market or wet market. For an American, a market can be almost any kind of store, particularly a grocery store. A store, though, surprised me…. if a Filipino says “store” that means sari-sari store. For an American like me, I would say that any of the examples (the public market, a sari-sari store, or a store in a mall) could all be called a store. But, that would not be the case to a Filipino. Why is it like this? Culture! Culturally, the definitions of these words are very specific for a Filipino. For us, they are more general. I mean, a “store” could be a convenience store, a grocery store, a store in a mall, any kind of business that was selling things to the public would be a store! Of course, we don’t have sari-sari stores in the USA, or anything even remotely like that.
This lead to another extension of the discussion. I already knew the word “tindero” which is a person who works in a store. After learning about the definition of a tindahan, I now assumed that a tindero (or tindera if it’s a female) was only a person who worked in a sari-sari store. I had always thought that a tindero was any clerk in any store. So, I asked Bebe, “what do you call a person who works in the store in the mall, you can’t call them a tindero, right?” Well, she surprised me again with her answer! “You will call them a tindero,” she said! Wow, so the place where they work cannot be called a tindahan, yet they are a tindero! ha ha… I found this fascinating!
Isn’t it funny how our culture influences the words we choose so much! In one culture things that are very general and can be applied to a number of things suddenly won’t work in another culture!
One thing that I feel is that by learning more about the language it helps you learn little tidbits like this. And, in learning this, even though it is a very small thing, it does open my mind up to understanding the culture more. It is something I enjoy.
Oh, and by the way… I asked my teacher another question, “if palengke is public market, tindahan is sari-sari store and mall is the mall, what would you call a convenience store?” She had to stop and think for only a second…. “convenience” she said! Sus!
Hi Bob,
It is really great that you are making an effort to learn to speak Bisaya. If I may ask, what school do you go to?
Well, I am Bisaya also … born and bred in Davao City. I have always known that tindahan is a generic term for store. May it be a store inside a mall, or convenience store like 711, sari-sari store, an independent store in the palengke, or NCCC store, etc.
You are also right to say that a tindero or tindera is the sales clerk in the store or tindahan.
If we reduce the word tindahan and or tindero into its root word, they are as follows:
Tinda ………. means sell, to sell, or merchandise. (although
merchandise can also be called paninda).
han …………. means the place. (ie: eskwelahan, paradahan, etc.)
'ero / 'era …… someone who sells, or assist in selling a merchandise.
I hope I am able to contribute something BOB.
Goodluck to your trip to New Bataan. although my friend hasn't responded yet, I am almost certain this is the place I mentioned to you before.
Bob,
At the end of your post you exclaimed "Sus". My wife who is from Cebu says that when she is very frustrated. I always thought it was a shortened version of "Jesus". ('sus)
What do you take it to mean?
Mark
Hi Joy – Thanks for your contribution there! I appreciate it. Actually, after writing this, my wife and I had an interesting conversation. I was telling her what my teacher told me yesterday about "tindahan" being only a sari-sari store. She disagreed and said it is any store. Well, I polled other people in my house and 2 said it is only a sari-sari store, but 3 said it is any store! Ha ha…. Now I'm getting confused! 😆
I don't go to a school for my language class. I have a private teacher who comes to my house. She is very good, and I am very happy with her lessons that she gives me!
Hi Mark, – Yes, "Sus" is indeed short for "Jesus" and is used commonly here for frustration, or exclamation. I threw that on the end, and my intent was to see how many comments it would take before somebody asked about it! So, now I know… 2nd comment! 😆
Bob Your wife and mine are in agreement about the word tindahan being used only to mena sari-sari store although, in this region, according to my wife, it is rarely used, Sari-sari stores are called 'stores' The larger stores here are refered to as plazas. If there were malls here, they'd be called malls. The larger stores Like Peoples Plaza and BE are refered to as plazas. The supermarket and the open market are both refered to as merkado.
As for the word 'sus'…my wife expl;ains,in her limited way, that it is more an exclamatory sound rather than a abbreviation of anything.
I'm sure by now, you've found that a few hundred km's can produce some cultural differences,that is why I usually refer to what I learn here as being indicative to the region I live in and not the whole island of Mindanao.
Good luck on your language lessons………I'm learning more as time goes on and, feel a little pressure. At most of the places we go, on a regular basis, I'm always being asked if I am learning the language and they want me to give them a demonstration of my abilitty. Very embarassing at times but……I'm learning.
Hi Bob,
Now you've got me confused. I am attempting to learn Tagalog (Filipino) and you say that you are learning Bisaya. In my Filipino-English dictionary "tindera/o" is listed as though it is a Tagalog word. Can you tell me which language it comes from? Did Tagalog adopt it from Bisaya or what? I have found many words like this. Thanks.
Hi Frank – It seems like your wife and mine disagree. My wife says that a tindahan can include a mall or any store. It is my teacher that your wife agrees with, I think. Not sure what region you are in, but here, I have never heard the word "plaza" used, also the supermarket would not be called a merkado either. It's funny how regional the Philippines can be!
Regarding the term "sus" it started out from what people used to say "Jesus, Mary & Joseph" which was then shortened to "Sus, Mari, Joseph" and now most people just say "Sus".
Good luck on your lessons!
Hi John – many words are shared between Tagalog and Bisaya, and other languages too. A lot of Spanish words are mixed in too. I don't know that anybody could say for sure which language originated which words and such.
My understanding is that the creation of the tagalog language came about from the words of the 8 main dialects. This was an attempt to create a national language. Can someone state whether this is true or not!
I'm presently learning Ilongo as this is the local dialect of the area that I will be moving to.
So Bob if I meet you and converse to you in Ilongo but you only know Bisaya will this mean a conversation can be held between us or are the local dialects vastly different ?
Hi Richard – No, you are talking about the Pilipino language! It is developed from words from many different dialects (please everybody, let's not get into the language/dialect fight, or I will shut down the discussion). Tagalog is one of the languages that Pilipino used as it's influence. Tagalog is an old language, not something that just came about. You men Pilipino.
If you learn Ilonggo and I learn Bisaya, we would have a VERY hard time communicating with each other.
Thanks Bob for making the issue clearer(Tagalog/Philipino). Just goes to show you can't believe everything you read. So Bob have you heard of any funny stories where . . . lets say for example a person speaking Ilongo rings the local building supplies and orders 100 planks of wood. Unbeknown to him the person on the other end of the phone at the wood supply outlet only speaks Bisaya, or maybe knows a little Ilongo but not much. And for this example we will say the word for wood in those two languages is different so that the person wanting the wood gets maybe cork or something equally as bizarre.
Basically what I'm wanting to know is whether this difference in dialects creates any kind of confusion with communication? And if it does are there any funny stories out there?
Hi Bob,
Joy is right that "Tindahan" means a store or any place that sell so a mall can be one BIG tindahan but since this a new concept (the mall) we don't reallty have any equivalent words for that so we simply use the english word for it.
I don't know the proper cebuano or bisaya term for a wet market or an open market but in Cebu they call it Mercado which is actually a spanish word, but I grew up knowing that we call it "palengke" there in davao so i'm not sure if that word is tagalog or cebuano. Maybe AmericanLola knows. 🙂
Hi Richard,
When I was still young, I met this ilonga girl who can only speak her language and me knows only cebuano and tagalog. While trying to be friendly with her, I can't get any reply from her as she don't understand me that out of frustration I blurted out "UNSA MAN KA DI KA KA- SABOT?" (meaning: "can't you understand?"), and she suddenly stand up, wide eyed and slapped me on the face and walked away! "Sabot" in illongo has a different meaning and that's the only word I think she understood… 😳
Ok here's a couple more joke but you need somebody who knows our languages so you can get it:
Sa Luzon ang "langgam" gumagapang pa lang pero sa bisayas ang "langgam" ay lumilipad na.
Sa Pampanga naman ang "Ibon or Ebon?" ay itlog pa lang pero sa katagalugan ay lumilipad na rin.
Hi Richard – I am sure there are many incidents of people speaking different languages and such! Some are very funny, although I don't remember them right at this time.
Hi Rey – Thanks for sharing your opinion on that. I think that either palengke or merkado is good for the public market! The tindahan is giving me many different opinions! I am kind of waiting for AmericanLola to chime in with her opinion, I'd be interested to hear it!
Hey Rey,
Apparently "sabot" in Ilongo means "pubic hair." No wonder she went wide eyed and slapped you. Now that is funny, although i guess it wasn't funny at the time.
Okay, here I am, chiming in! I've been in Iligan for over a week and a bit out of touch! I am pretty sure that 'palenke' is the Tagalog word commonly used for what we would call the 'wet market.' Davao has a lot of Tagalog influence, more than other places in Mindanao, so there are more Tagalog words used in Davao Bisiyan speech. Here in CDO, we always call the wet market 'merkado.' The wet markets are refered to by name, Agora, Cogon or Carmen, so people will say, "Magadto ko sa merkado." (Adto kog merkado) and will be asked, "Sa Cogon?" "Dili, sa Agora." The word 'Agora' actually means market in Latin!
For us, a tindahan is any small store, from a sari-sari to a 24 hour convience store. Large gorcery stores are called by their names, Gaisano, Oro-rama, Robinson or SM. There are a lot of minor variations in vocabulary through out Mindanao, but most people will understand what the other person means who uses a different word.
There are some pretty interesting things that happen when people from different languages try to communicate. 'Aso' means dog in Tagalog and smoke in Bisayan. 'Langgam' means bird in Bisayan and ant in Tagalog. And as mentioned above, some very polite and normal words in Bisayan mean something quite bastos in other Filipino langages! We learned that it is just safer to tell people to wait just a minute by saying, "Ka dali* lang, ha?" instead of "Kadyot lang ha?"
Hi Bob:
Being absent from class to do your practicum or immersion is a good thing to hone your language skills! 😉
Now, you're really getting filipinized with your "Sus" ender ! My husband exclaims "Jeez" !
This post makes me 😀 !
I'm just gonna look for a nice hard desk and bang my head on it !!
ps good article Bob….thanks for contributing to my flat spot forehead !
I concur with AmericanLola about "tindahan" being a small store (which covers sari-sari stores) and larger stores are called by it's name. That pretty much sums things up.
I've never used "Mercado" for a wet market. "Palengke" is what I say, but that is maybe because I am from Davao (a mixed immigrant city).
You can basically approach it this way, if a store leans towards a modern or westernized look, then just use the name. If it's more mom & pops, like a sari-sari or a small-business convenience store, then say "tindahan".
market is a public wet market.
I can understand some of the poster being confused by the mixed dialects. If it puts things in perspective, I'm a 31 year old Dabawenyo and there are still some Filipino words that I am not sure if it's Tagalog or Bisaya — even when I normally speak Tagalog. When I am in doubt, I just shy away from using them to a Tagalog speaker. Shows how interwoven the dialects and culture can be in the country.
Hi AmericanLola – I have been wondering what happened to you! Ha ha…. Thanks for sharing your input on this issue, I appreciate it.
Hi Jul – Thanks for your nice words. I am glad that I got your husband on that one! 😆
Hi Brian – Don't pound too hard!!!
Hi Macky – You're back! Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this as well.
Another thing about "Sus" from what I know in Tagalog is that it's also a shortened version of "susmariosep" from the longer version "Hesus Maria Joseph" (the holy family of Jesus, Mary and Joseph). Old Tagalog women, especially those with very religious Catholic upbrining, will usually blurt this out in times of surprise (gulat), astonishment, or disbelief. This is said (from what I know ha, not very sure) as a sign of protection (somewhat like incanting divine self-protection from the holy family). And many years that phrase was shortened to "susmariosep"
to yes, the "sus" for Jesus.
As for AmericanLola's inputs, yes, she is indeed right about difference in meaning of some Tagalog words and Bisaya. One word I know that was blurted by a Bisayan lady to her friends in Manila was that she was "nalibog" inside the city, which got some surprised and wide-eyed looks from the people since this means in Tagalog "in heat" or "feeling lustful". But she only meant "nalito" or "lost / confused" while in a big city like Manila.
Hi Jio – Thanks for your further explanation! Your explanation about "Sus" exactly coincides with what I know about it too. 😀
Hello Everybody,
Richard is asking if there are any funny jokes about being "LOST IN TRANSLATION".
I am sure there are a lot.
Bulbol … In Ilongo means facial hair or body hair (not pubic hair)
In Bisaya it means just that, pubic hair.
Nalibog … in Bisaya it means confused, in tagalog it is horny.
This is one funny story I will never forget. I don't mean to insult anyone but I heard this as a joke only.
Here goes the story …
An Ilongo speaking girl went to Manila City to work as a house helper. She's really smart and learns to speak Tagalog very quickly. Although her accent is still thick, she speaks correct tagalog perfectly with correct grammar. Her name is Inday.
One saturday morning, an insurance agent knocks on the door. Mr & Mrs were still in their bedroom, after all it's saturday and they have nothing planned for the day.
The Insurance Agent asked Inday if the "bosses" are in. He is there to follow up on the proposal he had given them few days ago.
Inday asked the Agent to wait outside while she knocks on Mr & Mrs' bedroom.
In her thick Ilongo accent, speaking in tagalog:
"Ser, mam … nandito po ang insurance agent, gusto kayong makausap"
(Sir/Ma'm … your Insurance Agent is here and would like to talk to you")
Mr & Mrs find the proposal interesting but they are not fully convinced. Mrs. says: "HHHmmmm, Inday, I am not sure. I think we need more time to think about this. Go tell him we are still having second thoughts."
Inday without wasting time went back to the agent to deliver the response.
With her thick Ilongo accent, Inday said to the Agent:
"Sori ser, sabi ni mam balik na lang daw kayo at nagse-second thought pa kuno sila!."
(("Sorry sir, Mrs is asking you to come back another time, they are having second thoughts right now."))
Ha ha ha ha.
_________________________________________________________
Are you lost in translation now?
okay, here's a tagalog-english (taglish) lesson:
Please take note of the prefix NAG
followed by the first syllable of the original word. in this case SE fron the word SECOND.
combine these two syllables to arrive at a tagalog prefix NAGSE
NAGSE-SECOND thought ….. meaning having a second thought.
but they way Inday says it in Ilongo accent made it sound like
NASISIKANTOT in real tagalog word, which means having sex.
__________________________________________________
I hope I made some of you laugh.
Thanks Bob, this topic has enlightened, helped, and confused a lot of people. 🙂 It's been real interesting hearing from all the different corners of the Philippines. Too bad you couldn't turn it into a regular Q&A column on Philippine languages, words, and their meanings.
Hi Bob – another term that we also use for market is “tiangi” (pronounced with a “cha” and originates from the Spanish word for “flea market”). We would say “maniangi ko” (I’m going to the market) and “sa tiangihan” (in/at/to/by the market).
Here’s a couple of “lost in translation” examples:
“Si Juan nalibang.” This translates:
In tagalog “John is amused.”
In bisaya “John is having a pooh (in the toilet).”
A bisaya street vendor is selling some fresh prawns and a tagalog customer is interested.
Bisaya vendor: Pasayan, pasayan (Prawns, prawns)
Tagalog customer: Magkano ho ba? (How much are they?)
Bisaya vendor: Dili kini kano, payasayan kini. (They are not Americans, they are prawns.)
Tagalog customer: Malalaki ba? (Are they big?)
Bisaya vendor: Sagul-sagul babaye ug lalaki. (They are a mixture of female and male.)
Hi again Bob,
Marilou got her comment in before I could send you this example. Hers is very funny – could make a good John Cleese movie from it for Filipinos except no one would understand it! 🙂
I found this today on a webiste (http://bucaio.blogspot.com/2005/11/latik.html) while researching Filipino cooking and looking up the word "latik" on the internet:
Latik in Filipino means a caramely sauce topping made by cooking together gata (coconut cream) and panutsa (molasses cakes). In Pangasinan, however, when you say latik you refer to a type of kanen (kakanin, sticky rice pudding) with latik topping. I gathered this is known as bibingkang kakanin in Metro Manila, bibingkang malagkit in Cavite, calame nasi in Pampanga, biko in the Bicol region, and I don't know what else in other parts of the country, if eaten at all.
Discouraged yet! I'm not – it's educational.
Well, in case anyone doubted that these are different languages, not jsut dialects of the same language, we have proved it here! 🙂 Wonderful jokes!
Hello everyone!Hi Bob! I guess same principle applies to the word libog (lee-bog). In Bisaya it means confused but in Tagalog it means horny. So be careful how you say it! Linguistics is very complicated yet interesting especially in the Philippines. Just imagine how many dialects we have considering we have 7,100 islands (high tide) 7,101 islands (low tide).
Its true that Davao is a mixed migrant (from one region to another) city. The actual dialect or vernacular in the city is Maguindanaon which is also a mix of the various dialect of the native or indigenous settlers. When they moved farther back to the highlands, migrants from Luzon and Visayas came to the city (who now became the old rich of Davao where existing street names were named after) influenced the new vernacular – Tagalog/Bisaya. Bisaya in Davao should not be confused with Cebuano although similar, the latter is geared towards being slang and with a richer twang.
Bisaya and Cebuano have the Spanish influences like the words merkado, kutsara, lamesa, numero and so on. I survive conversing with Mexicans here in CA because of my knowledge in Bisaya dialect!
Also, consumerism has its contribution in linguistics. In Davao provinces, it is acceptable to say a brand name to mean a generic name. For example, when you go to the tindahan, you can say "palit ko ug colgate" , and the tindero/a will ask you, "unsa man na klase?" (what brand?) or you can simply say, "palit ko ug colgate kanang close-up". When people want to take photographs, they say, "magpa kodak kita" or they simply call a camera or the art of taking photographs as "kodak". If you want to buy LPG, just say Gasul (although some opt for Shellane). Amazing, isn't it? Those products have brand equity definitely. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
FYI: Kodak or taking photos in Bisaya is "pahulagway".
Hi Joy Co – Thanks for sharing all of your examples! It is very interesting!
Hi John – It's always my goal to confuse as many people as possible! I think I'm pretty good at that too!
Hi Marilou – Ha ha…. I'm glad they are not Americans that are being sold! 😀
Hi John – Now it's you who is trying to confuse me! And, it's working! 😡
Hi AmericanLola – Yes indeed!
Hi CharlieV – Yes, the use of brand names in a generic way is rampant here. I think it's not only in Davao too, but nationwide.
Post #26
I don't think Maguindanaoan is the vernacular used in Davao City, maybe you were referring to some town in Cotabato and Maguindanao Provinces which has several dialects also . AFAIK, it is davaoeño or mandayan and manobo that was being used before .
Hi Guys, Here's some additional Bisaya/Tagalog Confusion 😉
Bisaya – English – Tagalog – English
Diin Where – Diin Press on
Gulang Old – Gulang Defraud
Daan Old – Daan Street/Road
Kuting Bedbug – Kuting Kitten
Lingkod To sit – Lingkod To serve
Tinapa Sardines – Tinapa Smoke fish
Luya Weaken – Luya Ginger
Pilit Sticky (rice) – Pilit Pressurize
Kumot squeeze – Kumot Blanket
Bukid Mountain – Bukid Farm
Bao Turtle – Bao Coconut hush
Luwag Ladle – Luwag Spacious
Ihaw Slaughter – Ihaw Grill
Toyo Soy Sauce – Toyo Dried fish
Bulak Flower – Bulak Cotton bud
Ubod Shoot – Ubod Very
Abot Produce – Abot Reach
Luwa Spit – Luwa Protrude
Taya Rust – Taya Bet
Bulag Separate – Bulag Blind
Pook Deepen – Pook Village
Asawa Wife only – Asawa For Husband and Wife
Bitin Snake – Bitin Dissatisfied
Tutok Staring at – Tutok Pointing at
Suko Angry – Suko Surrender
🙄 😕 🙂
Hi Rey – Yep, no doubt that Maguindanaoan is not the language of choice in Davao. I missed that on the original post.
Hi Teng – Wow, you are quite full of examples! 😆
Good illustration of a point I've been trying to make to people for years … it doesn't pay to try to get to concrete or technical in translation. Many Americans fall into this trap … if they know "X" they figure they will also know "X" once they fin dout the Filipino translation of "X". Ain't necessarily so,
One very interesting concept that many don't recognize is the number of Spanish/bastardized Spabish words in Filipino (and I know you are learning Bisayan, which isn't Tagalog or "Pilipino", but Spanish words like "palengke" are common throughout the Philippines. Inherit in Spanish and most to the Romance languages is the very strong sense of gender … words are strictly categorized into feminine and masculine. This is pretty foreign to many Americans … always with the 'a' or the 'o' … but it's also foreugn in it's own sense to Filipinos becuase Tagalog (and thus Pilipino) doen't even have common gender-specific pronouns (not sure about Bisayan). This causes a lot of mental gymnastics … becuase you better not refer to the doctor as "doctor' if it is a female, it's obviousy Doctora … but then even a well-educated Filipino, when asked what the doctora said, will often reply, "_He_ advised staying on the meds" … sometimes catching and correcting him/herself, other times pressing right on and not even realizing the incongruity of "genderizing" names because the Spanirrds did and using those words in sentences in a "genderless" langauge.
Gives me a headache, think I'll go to the chemist for some aspirin LoL.
Hi Dave Starr – Yep, Bisaya is just the same, no gender specific pronouns. People often say "he" when talking about a female, or "she" for a male! It sounds funny at first, but I am kind of used to it now!
aiii hehehahahaha.. All this different meaning of a word in Philippines language is funny….Reminds me that our language is rich and interesting.