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It’s a matter of right and wrong

Family, School / by

Lots of things in life fall into a gray area.  They are neither 100% right nor are they 100% wrong.  They are somewhere in the middle.  Things that we consider right can still have a bit of wrong mixed in, and the same for things we consider wrong.  It’s a judgment call in many cases.  That’s one reason why if you ask 100 people to judge something, some will judge it one way, and some will say the opposite.  It is a gray area that is being judged.

A week or so before Christmas, though, Feyma and I were faced with a situation that was really truly a matter of black vs. white, right vs. wrong, no gray.

One night, our daughter Jean came to us and wanted to talk.  It was pretty clear that she was nervous to talk to us about whatever it was that was bothering her.  We reassured her that she was free to open up to us, and that we would help her with whatever the problem was.

Jean proceeded to tell us that she had been accused of cheating on a test at school.  I was kind of surprised, because although I know that all kids do things that are wrong, I just didn’t think this was part of Jean’s character – to cheat on a test.  I asked her to explain what happened.

Jean told us that during a test, a classmate sitting next to her gave Jean a candy wrapper and asked her to throw it away in the garbage can.  Jean took the candy wrapper and tossed it into the garbage can in the classroom.  Somehow, it came to be that the candy wrapper had answers for the test written on the inside.  I questioned Jean about it, and she assured me that she had not cheated or even looked at the candy wrapper, she only threw it away.  I told her that during a test, she should concentrate on her test, and not on throwing away other people’s trash, but if what happened was as she described, I personally did not see how that could be considered cheating.

Jean told us that the Principal of the School had called a meeting with all of the kids involved, and their parents.  Of course, we attended the meeting (only 3 parents did) when it occurred a few days later.  In all, there were 11 students accused of using the candy wrapper to cheat.  I talked with the Principal and also Jean’s class teacher.  I asked them one question:

Did the answers on Jean’s test paper match the answers on the candy wrapper?

The response from the teacher and Principal was clear… the answers on Jean’s test were not the same as what was on the candy wrapper.  I asked them, how could she be considered to be cheating when her answers were different from the paper that had the answers on it?   They had no answer for me.  The Principal then told me that Jean had voluntarily admitted to them that she was involved with the cheating.  Well, Jean had been adamant to me that she was not involved. At this point, I told the Principal that I wanted to see Jean.  She told me no, that I would not be allowed to see her.  I raised my voice a bit, and repeated my request.  No, she said.  At this point I stood up and spoke in a very stern voice that Jean was my child, and I wanted to see her immediately (I did not yell, I spoke sternly and in a slightly raised voice).  Upon my third demand to see my child, they agreed and brought her to us.

When Jean arrived in the Principal’s Office, I asked her if she had admitted to being involved in cheating.  She replied quite strongly that she had not.  At this point, the Principal gathered all of the other 10 students together, and she asked them if Jean was involved with them in cheating.  One by one, each gave the same answer – NO.

You know, if we had not attended the meeting, I have no doubt that Jean would have been considered guilty, and punished.  I am glad that we went there.  Don’t get me wrong, if Jean would have been involved, I would have said that she should be punished, but since there was no evidence of her involvement, there should be no punishment.  Yes, she made a mistake by even touching the paper, and should have concentrated on her test, but that is a minor thing compared to cheating.

Jean had been told, before we went to the school, that her punishment would be that she would have to write a letter of apology, and that she would have to go up on the stage in front of all of the students of the school and read her apology.  To me, that is demeaning of the student, especially if innocent (and it seems that there was little worry over innocence or guilt).

I think that the school administrators saw that we would not sit back and do nothing, and that our handling of the situation made them think twice.  I’m glad that they decided to back off, because if they had not, I would have stood my ground as long as necessary.

Reader Interactions

Comments

  1. Hi Bob: This is indeed a difficult lesson for Jean, especially broken trust among her peers. Before I give out exams in my classroom, I repeat the rules that I enforce: go to the bathroom before the exam, talking or handing any item to other students not allowed, all cell-phones off, address any questions to me only. It’s good that you attended the meeting. Filipino administrators and teachers do not usually stand-down. (My late parents were former professors in a Filipino university.) They are proud and cannot admit “mistakes” openly. This is called “Hiya”.

    • Hi Roselyn – Yes, people don’t want to lose face, but when they are wrong and you press them on it, you can usually get results. You just have to decide on which instances you should do that.

      • Bob

        It’s really good that you did attend because it seems there was no doubt Jean would have been found guilty. Its sad the way it was handled by the principal, she is supposed to be the leader of the school, saving face or not. Its even sadder that only 3 parents bothered to even show up. I”m glad that the truth came out. Take Care.

  3. good job Sir Bob,teachers in the Philippines sumtyms jump into conclusion and do drastic actions without investigating first.It´s easy for them to judge and humiliate students with out considering the effect ´of their actions.As a parent , ´ll do the same like you did or maybe more hysterical.Kodus!

  4. Well Bob…one thing for sure..Your Jean-Jean got some great reinforcement that She can always go to her parents and talk things out and also She saw that Her Parents were willing to stick up for Her . She will never forget this experience….Now as far as some teachers go…soem times they think they are always right and never wrong because they are the teacher..call it pride or proud or just plain that they have a screw or 2 lose sometimes…To me a good teacher is a person that knows that they are never always right and soem times wrong and are big enough to admit it and because they are a good teacher they understand they can even become a better teacher by addmitting if they are wrong and also a good teacher does not shame the student infront of the other students…….same goes for a good boss..if they have a problem with a employee they disscuss the problem with the employee and not chew the employee out in front of all the other employee’s. Of course I understand that Asian Peoples do not like to lose face, but some times that part of their culture in my mind could be a determent to what they could fully realize of out life…It takes a humble and big person to admit they are wrong, yet the person that can addmit they are wrong will in many ways progress futher thant he person that can not….any way…You did good Bob..

    • Hi Dan – You know, after reading what you said, a thought occurred to me… I think that by admitting that you are wrong can actually help you gain stature in the eyes of others. People will think “oh, he is very fair” and that sort of thing. So, by being willing to lose a bit of face, the person can in fact gain face. Interesting thought.

      Thanks for your comment, Dan.

  5. A difficult situation that I think you and Feyma handled very well! And Jean-Jean knows that you will listen, be fair and stand up for her!

    • Hi AmericanLola – Well.. to be honest, Feyma got a little aggravated at me for (slightly) raising my voice. But, she seems like she is OK about it now, though…. 😉

  6. interesting article about your daughter at school, i suggest it is because you are a foriegner , that you got a result in your favour, as pinoys seem to just sit back and except all the crap that is thrown at them, maybe because they think everyone is better than them, maybe they really are shy, and frightened to be made to look like idiots. All i know is this,everytime i raise my voice, in the philippines when i’m in the right, i get results, now as a quiet person needless to say, does not do my blood pressure any good, but i respect you in your prompt action, on behalf of your daughter, and i say to everyone please stand up and be counted, if a system needs to be changed change it.

    • Hi Edward – I think that being a foreigner helped me succeed in my quest that day, but I also feel that if a Filipino had really stood up for what was right (unlikely) they probably could have gotten the same results. Thanks for your comment, edward!

  7. Ur daughter got set up by that other student and was being railroaded by the principal! I wud have turned to the principal and asked them to explain themselves as to this lie, if my kid said to me, in front of the principal no less, that she had not fessed up to being a part of this cheating conspiracy. Ever think ur daughter was being accused of this because she is of “mixed” blood? I know my girlfriend has been treated with prejudice because on me. And she’s a minister, a well respected member of her community!

  8. Hi Bob – I don’t believe in “gray areas” when it comes to right or wrong. If it’s minimally wrong, it’s still wrong. It’s like being pregnant – you can’t be just a little pregnant!

    Judges decide on people’s honesty to report on an act (be it a right or wrong act). If there was no wrong committed, there’d be no real need for judges.

    Just a thought! 😉

  10. Hi Bob & Feyma, I commend you both for being actively involved parents, something that is lacking in today’s society. However, I do not feel that the ” how dare you question the teacher” mentality is unique to the Filipino school system. Many so called educators in the US have the same attitude of ” I know what’s best for your child” . Society needs more parents like you !

  12. Bob: So sorry this happened… It is a tough lesson that Jean had to learn about other people and trust. In the end, she’ll be stronger for having experienced it.

    What is surprising to me is that only 3 of 11 parents bothered to attend. With all that is made about private schools in the Philippines and parental sacrifices for kids to go to school here, I find it sad that the same lack of concern pervasive in the US appears to have reached these shores.

    • Hi John – Yes, it was a tough ordeal for her, but I am happy that all is cleared up now. Personally, I was not surprised at the low attendance of parents, in fact, I sort of suspected it. Part of the sacrifice that the parents make includes things like working overseas to financially support that education, so they cannot attend. That said, whoever the caregiver of the child is should have been there.

  13. Hi Charlie – Actually my daughter is adopted, so she is not of mixed blood, she is 100% Filipino. Personally, I don’t think that in this case it was a matter of discrimination against her, because the person who passed the candy wrapper to her readily told the Principal that Jean was not involved. But, the school administrators jumped to conclusions without thinking it out.

    • One of the things that makes life a lot less enjoyable for me here is the pervasive inferior attitude so many Filipinos carry with them and let shape their lives. “We’re just little people and we have no rights against authority”. Filipinos need to stand up and be counted, even against petty tyrants like school administrators. Good on you that you stood your ground.

      Another thing that distresses me a bit is the pervasive belief of foreigners that everything that happens, especially those things with a negative context, happens to them “becuase they are foreigners”. Everything that goes wrong doesn’t happen “becuase we are foreigners here”. A modification of Napoleon’s maxim applies. Never ascribe to malice (toward foreigners) what can be adequately explained by ignorance.”

      This was an “ignorant” situation which fortunatately was rectified by parental intervention.

      I believe the original incident and also the outcome did not happen becuase of “foreigner bias”. Could be I’m wrong on this, but it is an opinion based upon my own experiences.

      • Hi Dave – I tend to agree with you about the “everything happens to us because we are foreigners” thing. Well, think about it, there were 11 kids accused in this, and on Jean had a father who was a foreigner, so that makes it pretty clear that we were not singled out. Just wrongly accused. To me, you are right on target with what you say.

  14. Bob, I also think that your approach took them by surprise. Your reaction was not unusual by American standards but probably was (you know better than I) by Filipino standards. I’m glad everything turned out for the good.

  15. Ha ha… yes, it was indeed, Michael. I kept asking them to show any evidence that Jean was guilty and they had none…. it was like they didn’t know what to do!

  16. I question the motive of the teacher of not wanting you to see your daughter….how dare her/him refuse you that request ! Well done Bob.

    • I found it pretty appalling that they would not allow me to see or talk to Jean. I mean, as her parent, I believe that it is my right to see her whenever I wish to do so. That was the point when Feyma wished I had just sat there quietly… but that’s just not me. I didn’t lose control, though, just insisted that I see my child.

  17. Good on ya bob ,trust your children i would have had some stern words to the principal i think had they accused my daughter of cheating and she hadnt and good on the others for standing up and telling the truth ,for some reason in the phillipines becaause you are a teacher it seems that becuase you are a proffesional that you must be revered and not questioned or this is my interpretation anyway for me you could be the b……y president and if i thought you were telling porky pies i would let you know but that is our western culture and freedom of speech isnt it there seems to be a cultural staircase and 90% of the filipinos live in the ground floor or just above on the first or so it seems to me anyway ,i am probably wrong but thats my veiw
    cheers chris

  18. Bob, I am glad of the outcome. You stood your ground, used logic, and let the truth prevail.
    It seems that the school principal and teacher are suspects in fabricating stories about Jean. If her answers were not the same as what was on the wrapper, either Jean did not cheat, or she is a terrible cheater. Also, I found it odd that they would prevent you from seeing Jean. Maybe they were very nervous to have her “testimony” prove that they were lying about Jean’s involvement.
    I hope this does not affect Jean’s remaining school term, nor your futures dealings with the school.
    Jean surely must be proud of Femya and you for your 100% support and belief that she told you the truth, and defended her against the false charges.

    • Hi Lloyd – Yeah, I really believe that the outcome was exactly what I wanted and as it should have been too. I believe that the school administrators realized that they were caught in a lie when they told me that Jean admitted to wrongdoing, and that is why they refused to get her when I asked.

  23. We run into that kind of arbitrary and unfounded accusation by faculty against our kids at Ateneo from time to time. For the smaller matters we’ve just explained to the kids that there will always be insecure people in authority who act like petty tyrants just because they have power. Last year I was poised for a show down like you had but the matter resolved itself before it came to a head.

  25. Hi Tom – I have had similar incidents with Ateneo as well. I have even found times when they are teaching my boys information which is factually incorrect. I explain it to the boys, teach them the proper information, and just don’t make waves. If it were something serious, I’d have to make a stand, though.

  27. Bob, we get lots of factually innacurate stuff and it usually has something to do about America. Like you, we just roll with it and make sure the kids have the truth. Some of the assertations are so laughable that the kids come back to the house saying, “You’ll never believe what my teacher said today…”

  29. you did what was just needed Bob,great papa indeed!! this is also a good lesson for jean to hone her confidence in taking a stand and speaking up tactfully when needed,so others will not just step on her rights in the future…

  31. good for you and good for her, Bob! i hope more parents would be as assertive and interested. studies have shown the more involved parents are with what happens in their kids’ schools, the better the kids’ grades generally are.

  33. This is my comment to BOB…

    Any conduct of Examination has rules and guidelines. Cheating is 1 of that.

    In any examination…all form of unfair means are consider cheating even she took the candy wrapper from some1. A student should not allow her self to deal with fellow students during examination because it is not allowed too.

    A parent has no right to Question the authority of the school administator or principal esp. in the Conduct of Exam. They are following Rules and Guidelines in the Conduct of Exam.

    I didnt agree how Bob confronted the principal. What you only do is to mediate the issue of the child. Basically the child commit cheating…even she did not copy from inside of the candy wrapper.

    I am an Engg Lecturer too….I dont tolerate cheating or unfair means….

    The Principal action was correct to read out aloud the apology of the child to fellow students.This is to remind children that cheating will not
    be beneficial or a moral value of a good student.

    • Jalil dude, what are you?! I disagree with your comments!!

      There was no freaking cheating! I’m glad Bob confronted the teacher! The daughter Jean, threw candy wrapper which the other students who should have been punished asked her to throw! The punishment is a stupid one! My God! To even ask to write an apology add read out loud to the other students knowing that that child did not cheat, Like Bob said, that is so demeaning!

    • Dear Mr. Almeda,

      I agree she made a big mistake touching the candy wrapper. Hopefully she learned from the experience. But if Mindanao Bob hadn’t confronted them he would have never gotten to the truth that she never used it to cheat and wasn’t part of the chicanery.

      You have different attitude. I say question all authority. If you don’t there will continue to be many injustices in the world. Especially when it comes to protecting the integrity of your family.

      POPS!

    • Jalil,

      ????? Where are you coming from ????? As an educator myself (higher ed), the sop is:

      1. you catch them in the act
      2. you have convincing evidence (e.g. two test papers with exactly the same answers word for word even mispellings, etc)
      3. you catch with cheat sheet on them, their desk/seat/work area.

      The principal/administrator were way out line here. The principal should have arranged the meeting with the parents AND the child together. They didn’t have the right to refuse the parent to have their child in the room. Their behaviour was a joke. Obviously, there was a rash of cheating in the class. If you can’t nail anyone with direct evidence, the only other way is to invalidate the test, give them a follow up test or change the way you deliver the test.

    • @Jalil,

      I strongly disagree with your comment. Perhaps this may have worked in another era but in this currently society? I point out especially to your comment

      [QUOTE]
      “The Principal action was correct to read out aloud the apology of the child to fellow students.This is to remind children that cheating will not
      be beneficial or a moral value of a good student.”
      [/QUOTE]

      What do you think the implication of this action to the student or students, by having them publicly humilated? A negative disciplinary action will not create a positive discipline. Yes, it will discourage others but it is not a healthy solution.

      @AlexB—I’m glad you’re in the education system. That’s more like it, a better solution.

  34. Hi Jalil – I am certainly happy that I do not see the world through the same eyes that you do. It must be a lonely place for you, since your outlook is so grim.

  35. Hey Bob – I so understand this situation! The same thing happened during my senior year of HS. 4th quarter exams. Did not happen t me but to another classmate. She was three seats away from me. Another classmate asked her to throw piece of paper that contained answers she didn’t even know. She should have ignored the request to throw the paper but she was near the trash can. She was asked to go to principal office. She cried so much. Her dad was math teacher in the school. Like you, the dad also stood his ground and defended his daughter. You know what, the cheaters got their answers from another teacher who were close them. Bad! That teacher was punished (expulsion.. I’m correct).

    Bob, I’m glad you did what you did! Sometimes we need to demand! The principal and teacher thought that since it’s their territory, they are the boss. I find their actions wrong.

      • Yep. Sad fact.. teachers do get close to students and sometimes do silly acts. The said shameful teacher though showed up when we had our graduation ceremonies. My classmate and his dad did not attend our graduation rites.

          • Bob, the teacher was investigated by school board and expelled from teaching at our school. Happened ages ago anyway. What a shame because reputation will forever be marred by that incident.

            Jean is lucky to have parents like you and Feyma. If I was asked to apologize on stage in front of students, and knowing I didn’t do any cheating, I’d fight it!

  36. U are right, i am just a frog that always wanted to go out of the “pool” context. Dont get me wrong or disappointed, i am saying what is the side too of the 2nd parents of the students (These mentors)…

    • Your point is good Jalil. Two sides to every story. Both my parents were teachers and i know they went thru a lot with the students.

    • Hi Jalil, unfortunately, these are still the attitude and culture of a lot of people in the Philippines, those in authority, law enforcement and the privileges. The reason the act like that is that they don’t like to be challenge, questioned even do they are wrong and that are some of the reasons holding the progress of this nation. People in that position have a hard time accepting fault and criticism and people are not assertive enough that’s why the other parents did not attend.

      The teachers never gave Jean a chance to explain, I bet. In contrast here in the US, in school environment, teacher can be open and stand side by side with the student and encouraging to challenge or explore ideas instead of one way environment. Not healthy at all.

      Bob, I’m glad you went and stood your ground.

      Mars

  37. Hey Bob,

    It is great that you stood up to them and defended her. The question did the answers on the gum wrapper match hers was a good one. That pretty much blew their case. Maybe you should have been a lawyer!

    The fact that they lied and said she confessed, just to save face, is really disturbing. What kind of people are these to be educating our children.

    Raising your voice was certainly warranted. You showed more restraint then i might have.

    These are the kind of things that you have to go thru with schools though. I have been thru some really unbelievable things with teachers and school admin.

    I lived in Virgina way back in the hills and a very conservative bus driver threw my 9 year old step son of the bus for saying the word “condom”. I had to take off work to go meet with the principal. Boy was I mad when i heard the story and the reason. I have a very strong voice.

    Good evening sir,

    Pops

    • Thanks, dave. Yes, when I was younger, I really wanted to be a lawyer! But, I am happy with what I ended up doing, though.

      I was really angry that apparently the school staff lied to try to cover up their own wrongdoing. It is quite shameful if you ask me!

  39. The school is the 2nd home of every students, and the teachers or the school administrators are the 2nd parents.And I believed they are parents themselves.As a parents you don´t want your child/children to be humiliated as possible.Even at times they made mistakes.Considering the psychological impact to each child.To make a public apology in that aged is unbearable to handle.The teachers are not always right.. They need to listened sometimes.>( my personal opinion)

  40. Humiliation is when “a teacher” shouted heavily infront of the public…

    Since …a teacher is requiring her “apology”…there was no humiliation…This is to tell others cheating is not good….

    • @ Jalil,

      The school can do that without humilating anybody. The school can do an asembly and let the whole school knows that during the examination process there were students who were caught cheating and as such sufferred the consequences by being [INSERT CONSEQUENCE HERE]. Then by re-iterating to the whole school that cheating is an offence and is not acceptably by any means/shape/form and will be punished. As a school this should be enough because the school itself is an authority figure.

      By having the accused to publicly apologize does not serve any purpose other than humilating the accused persons—which will hinder their personal growth especially in confidence to deal with other matters. Which ultimately, is very unproductive to the society.

  42. I am a parent and an educator myself too BOb,I used to teach in South Korea, where students, emotional and psycholigical aspects is most considered .If my students commit cheating, the parents attention is being called and the counselling will happen.Listening is vital and tactfulness in speech.Investigating the cause of the disease is important before treating it toavoid complications.

  43. GOOD JOB BOB……….. We had a case where the principal called us to school. Stepson has been sleeping in class, and was failing. To make a long story short, we met with the Teacher and principal. My wife said to me, they wanted Rubber Shoes and X amount of money, and he would get passing grade. That was his last day in that school.

      • Hi Bob…… I shoud add that it was a privat school, not a public school. The amount of money was small, fore me it’s just the ideal of it all. My whife said it was just a little happy money, for consideration.

    • @Jalil, I am so glad you made this comment! That’s exactly our point. Public humilation will neither be good for Career building as you will need your character as well. Schools these days now plays vital role for everything!

  46. But Jalil ,, Jean did not cheat.. we are talking here in Bob´s daughter´s case. Do you have a child of your own??? he is just a father who is ready to stand firm for his daughter. will you do the same as a parent?

  47. Jalil,, or just put yourself in Jeans shoe,, will you make a public apology infront of everybody accepting the crime you didn´t commit?? how would you feel?? AS a young lady??????

  48. Bob,

    I will state this: When it is this clear that you are not in the wrong, Stand Up, come hell and high water. Not only do you show the other people that you are willing to stand up for yourself, you also show everyone that you are willing to stand up for what is right.

    As an american in the Philippines, you are expected (down in their hearts) to practice what Uncle Sam has been preaching all this time – Stand Up for what is right ! You keep seeing this in the the movies, don’t you?

    You are also showing your daughter that you will back her when she is in the right, as a parent rightly should.

    • Hi DanielY – Personally, I don’t think this really has anything to do with being American, or anything that Uncle Sam taught me… Maybe we just see it differently. Thank you for your comment, though.

    • Not always. How about teachers who physically abuse students? From time to time, you hear that on news. Are they right about physically, emotionally, and mentally abusing students?

      I wonder if you even read the whole post!

    • Apparently, that is not the case in this situation. Tsk, tsk.

      Am I sensing some anti-Americanism here to the point of “twisting” the story here and agreeing with the teachers involved who are twisting the truth for the sake of their ego? Sorry, but you do not do the Philippines any good by agreeing with the crooked ways of some teachers. What you are doing is nothing different from agreeing with corruption.

    • Jalil– don’t be a sucker for people in positions of authority. Power can all too easily be abused.
      Contrary to what you claim, maraming gago sa mga opisyales. Wisdom is rare currency among the powers-that-be, and common sense isn’t as common among those who sit in judgment.

  51. Dear bob, i think what shocks me about this whole affair, is that your daughter had to make an apology, in front of the whole school, now you dont have to be a rocket scientist, to know how this would scar a young mind for the rest of there lives, how barbarous, slap in the face would be kinder.

  52. @leah…Go to school….read “the rules and guidelines of the conduct of examination…” and tell me if i am wrong…

    “Even talking to a classmate is a form of cheating.”

    If you are not comfortable with that school, transfer your child to another…these teacher’s are following the conduct of exam…

    • When was wrongly accusing and lying to parents “conduct of exam”? Even Bob’s daughter’s classmates testified that she was NOT part of it. The students who admitted to their mistake is more commendable here than the TEACHERS WHO LIED (for the sake of authority and saving face!) to make it look that Jean was part of the cheating. Ego over truth. *What a good example set for students!*

  53. alam ko po,, pero if totoo po ang akusasyon dapat po tlaga parusahan,, pero po pag di po naman involved iyong bata, tama din po na patawarin.Maestra din po ako o ikaw din po at bilang pangalawang magulang di po ba tama din na ang aspeto ngpsychological ay iyo ding responsilibilidad na pangalagaan di po ba?nature nurture …

    • Leah,

      I feel like translating your words in Tagalog to English so those who are not familiar to the Tagalog may understand what you have to say back to Jalil. I will do my best of translation. After all this is LIP website. I have to ask Bob if it’s OK with him. :0)

  54. Everybody can just easily say that they did not cheat….That’s why there are rules and guidelines in the “CONDUCT OF EXAMS”…for the teachers to administer in the exams….

    I didnt say the child did the cheating but the teachers were just exercising the conduct of exam….

  55. Had this occured in the states this probably never would have gone this far and just based on her answers would have resulted in a dismissal. You did the kind of thing an intelligent concerned parent would do abd got the inevitable result that had it been anyone else would never have gotten.
    I do not really understanding why it is so difficult for many here to grasp the concepts of common sense and logic. I am not trying to be insulting just observing that there are too many examples of this is Philippine society to dismiss it as aberration. Yes of course there are many instances of stupidity in the states it just seems to be more pronounced here especially in investigations which it seems you would have to have a video of someone killing someone and then have them smile at the camera and hold up a piece of paper with their name on it saying what they just did and that would probably end in their aquittal as well. Meanwhile a person miles away from a crime gets convicted. Go Figure. Well I am glad Jean is off the hook due to her honesty and her Dad’s determination

  56. I´m educated as you are Jalil ,,I studied and finished a degree in the philis, too . my point is even they follow the rules of conduct in examination,they have to investigate thoroughly b4 the judgment..mmmmm….

      • I meant this incident. I think the principal was on a power trip. I’ve met a few teachers, social workers, there on my trips and they seem to be very professional. Just doesn’t compute in my brain ?!?! Glad you handled that one right.

  58. I’ll tell u…kahit ako teacher ….alam ko na ito ang RULES AND GUIDELINES for the CONDUCT OF EXAMS….

    I require the student to apologize….or else….have u heard other schools imposing …expulsion?

    • How about the teachers involved APOLOGIZING for wrongly accusing a student.
      Super ego working!

    • Jalil:

      So teachers are omnipotent all-beings incapable of errors as long as they are following bureaucratic guidelines?

      For someone who is supposed to be educated and educating youth, that is an awfully ignorant position to take…Completely asinine. It is just as bad a small children in the States getting expelled under zero tolerance for merely drawing a picture of a weapon.

      Teachers are human beings and make mistakes, just as the children under their guidance. What sort of example does a teacher show by lying in order to escape consequences and defending some aura of invincibility.

      Perhaps that Jean should have known better than to accept an object from a student during a test. She learned her lesson only due to her father intervening when an obvious injustice occured. The teacher, rather than using the opportunity to teach the children about consequences, merely passed blame.

      I am in no way advocating cheating, nor was Bob… but by reinforcing that she should never question authority, the school is condemning students to a life of servitude.

    • If she apologizes for her supposed misdeed, I assume that the principal will also apologize for lying to Bob and Feyma about the “confession.”

  60. Bob,
    I also encountered this kind of situation when i’m in grade school, i have one teacher whom i dislike so much coz she was so fierce that i didn’t see her smiling even after i was graduated from elementary so she earned the name “MISS TAPIA”, she has the reputations of being so strict and bullying her students and always asking us like it was our obligations to buy her goods that she sells inside the room, take noteBob, she brought a lot of stuffs to school for her students to buy eg. ice candy, polboron biscuit crackers etc. so if we didn’t buy she gave us a warning that we are not going to pass in her subject……see how some teachers manipulate their sudents, how amazing right?

    • Sounds corrupt teacher to me and what a example of how to teach corruption to little school kids to learn at such a young age so they can grow up well educated in the art of corruption and carry on the corrupt way of life that their peers were leading.

      • Bob,
        Last thing i heard from this teacher is when a transfer student from a private school complained this and told his parents, you can imagine the scandal that was erupted around the school campus and i’m so glad that the principal did the right thing and fired her

    • Speaking of being fair, how “fair” is it to accuse her of cheating WITHOUT evidence? You are ignoring the FACT that there was no proof of her cheating (which she was ACCUSED of by the teachers).

      You know what, I think you are just playing the “devil’s advocate” for the sake of having a different take. You IGNORE a lot of facts

  63. Mahina ang school kung indi sinusunod ang “standards” nila….Di ba sa bahay, anong gagawin mo kung nagkasala ang anak….iimpose mo rin yung “standards” mo rin….kung sakaling di kayo comfortable sa standards ng school, ilipat nyo ang bata….

    • Translation of comment: The school is weak if their standards are not being followed. Isn’t it that inside the house, if a child made a mistake, you will also impose your own standards. If ever you’re not comfortable with the school’s standards, then transfer the child….

  64. wla tayong magagawa kung yun ang standards ng skul…I am a teacher too…i dont care kung ano sya ….ibabagsak ko ang bata kung nararapat….that’s my standard…as such prescribed ng school policies…

    dont get me wrong…this is my comment lng…no hurt feelings…

    • Great. A teacher who condones BAD EXAMPLES of some teachers.

      Don’t you get it? It’s not about the “Standards” of the school but how Jean’s teachers LIED just to include her name to show “authority”. Had Bob not not pressed, Jean would have been punished for something SHE DID NOT DO

      I really doubt you read the whole story!

    • Translation of Jalil’s comment: We can’t do anything is that’s the school’s standards. I am a teacher and I don’t care whatever it is. I will fail the child, if it’s whats needed.

      Jalil – You live in your own world.. and your own standards ( you mentioned prescribe by the school policies, wonder what school is that.. geez) and you’re trying impose them on us!

  65. Ganoon na lang po ang gawin ni Sir BOb, sa nangyaring ganyan sa anak niya talagang di na maging komportable ang anak niya, at ang maging epekto kay jean ay daladala niya habang nandiyan siya. It ´s big lesson to be learn.

  66. Please, no more comments in Tagalog. I can understand Bisaya or English, and since this is on my FB wall, I want and need to understand what is said. Thank you.

    • Goodbye Jalil, I think we know what your “standards” are based on your replies here. What a shame that you are a teacher or are you really?

  70. Jalil – Please do not tell me how to do my business. Please do not post additional Tagalog comments here. I am willing to allow you to post your opinions, as outrageous as I feel they are, but in English or Bisaya only, so that I can understand what is being written on my wall. That is all I have to say on the topic. If you don’t care to follow my guidelines, please post elsewhere. It is your choice.

  72. Bob – I guess Jalil only posts comments on your FB? Im thinking he didn’t read the whole post? and just like the principal, believes that you daughter is the one at fault. I betcha’ if he sees all reactions to his comments he’ll explode and be more adamant.

    Bob, you’re too nice. Me, I feel like socking his solar plexus. Yikes.

    • Jalil is quite annoying. He keeps repeating the same thing over and over. If he can’t come up with anything else, he should refrain from posting. He is not furthering his cause, even if misguided. What can’t Jalil comprehend?
      Jean is innocent of all trumped up charges brought against her by the school administrators and faculty. She took the test and did not cheat. Case closed.

      • I think Jalil is annoyed by the fact that a parent stood against the school administrators. I think he expects parents to not be involved with their children’s school matters and just agree with what the faculty do even if it is inherently and morally WRONG.

    • Hi sugar – Yes, Jalil’s posts were automatically imported here from my Facebook wall. Jalil always posts crazy thoughts to my FB almost every day, it seems. I have gotten to the point that I mostly ignore him.

  73. One point I think Jalil made is following the rules of conduct for the exam.

    If the principal had said something like, we know Jean didn’t cheat but the rules clearly indicate that there is to be no talking with other students, and no passing or accepting objects to/from students. Jean violated this rule, and there should be some consequence for that.

    However, the principal did not state that. The teacher and principal accused Jean of cheating, which was clearly wrong as evidenced by her answers. Then the principal lied about Jean voluntarily admitting her involvement.

    I’m not a parent, but if I had been in Bob’s shoes I would have done the exact same thing.

    Fortunately the students actually involved showed a lot of character.

    All that being said, cheating in school is rampant these days. Some may argue it’s a desirable trait for certain career paths :\

  74. Interesting discussion concerning subject one could encounter anywhere in the world…
    I can kinda understand Jalil’s position, he strictly follows certain protocol (as a robot would do) and won’t accept any deviation. His military style of conduct, however, is not acceptable for most free thinking people. I am pretty sure that he believes that what he does is right and honest thing to do in his line of work.
    The problem is that this kind of interaction with someone entrusted with certain authority looses human factor that most people would naturally rebel against.
    In my view, if we strictly wanted to follow “CONDUCT OF EXAM” Jalil preaches, Jean’s got burned by misconduct of her classmates and she did something that she was not supposed to do during exam but would be perfectly appropriate in any other situation. I am not sure if she deserves any punishment for this as view may differ dramatically depending on who casts verdict; “general’ Jalil or a person with logical thinking.
    She absolutely should NOT be accused of cheating and be demanded to apologize in front of everyone. Behavior of her teachers and the principal is disgusting since they decided to lie and subsequently try to prevent its exposure from position of authority in order to save face and avoid humiliation.
    In any case Bob, I would behave exactly same way if my child was involved, except, I am not sure I would be able to keep my cool as you did.

    • Hi Marcel – Interesting observations. On Jalil, he sometimes has strange ideas, and I try to ignore it if his ideas become too outlandish. It’s his right to think how he wants to think, though.

      Yes, I was happy with the way that I was able to handle the situation, and it turned out about the best it could, I think.

      Take care!

  75. In my opinion you did the right thing. I do not know if the other parents were Filipino or not, but too often Filipino’s tend to let those they perceive as authority figures run over them. I am glad that the school administration may have learned they are not God. Like you I believe right is right and wrong is wrong no matter who is involved and when I think that I am right I am going to stand by my convictions and if I am involved in a situation with someone else who is falsely accused and I think they are right I am going to stand by them. I admire the other students that stood strong for what they knew to be right and were not intimidated by the authority figure to say what they wanted to hear. That may have been a shock to the principal. It would have been easy for them to just say “I do not know.”

    • Tom.. Sometimes for fear of going against the authority or the higher ups, Filipinos tend to just let things be and not fight for what they believe is correct and what is due to them. Me, I said a while, I’d have stood my ground too.

    • Hi Tom – I was the only foreigner in the group, and all of the kids were pure Filipino. You know, as you said, I admired those other students who were involved, because they told the truth. As I sat there watching, I really felt good about that aspect of the situation.

      • Hi Tom and Bob: I’ll interject some thoughts for you to think about as you have children in the Philippines who are attending educational institutions. The Philippines is a feudal society and professional/public positions are acquired through connections (through family or close friends). School administrators, owners, teachers, and professional staff are usually related by blood or through marriage. There are long-term raminifications for defying the individuals of power and authority. Sometimes, parents may feel that the payback will hurt more than offend powerful families. Foreigners are free to come and go as they please. Long-term residents however, have connections that they feel they must maintain. Ponder these thoughts as what I say here is not mere “gossip” – as most foreigners would label what they don’t want to hear.

        • I am sorry, Roselyn, but I pretty strongly disagree with your assessment of the situation.

          BTW, Tom is a retired Priest, and thus has no children here.

          • Bob: My sharing of information is not an assessment of your situation nor Tom’s. It is merely sharing so that Expats would know as to why some of the parents did not get involved. You decide what is best for you.

            • dear roslelyn
              i am an ex pat living in the philippines, with a fifteen month old adopted daughter, so the supervision of her education will fall to me, now if i am correct in what you are trying to say is dont even attempt, to rock the boat, because there are powerful people out there, and there is ramninifications, for defying, people of power and authority, well roselyn, this is not only unique to the philippines, and one thing history has taught us is many battles have been won by standing up for your rights.

              • Edward: Don’ put words in my mouth. What I am saying here is that this is a reason why some families did not get involved. Do what you please with your life in the Philippines. I believe that this site is for sharing information, not for bashing.

          • I understand exactly what Roselyn is saying. As a former teacher I find the idea of always blindly accepting what a teacher says as appalling- but then – we are not in the USA or Canada anymore- we are in the Philippines now, and like it or not, many times things are not done the same way here.
            And shaming a teacher or principal in front of other parents- or even worse in front of students- is just not acceptable here. There are correct ways of doing things- and there are incorrect ways of doing things. We see our “standing up for our rights” to be a wonderful thing. Other cultures sometimes see it as being arrogant and bullying.

            • Ian – You were not there, and apparently did not read the article closely. I had a private meeting with the Principal and the Teacher before the other students were involved.

              • The way I read it, Ian isn’t making a judgment of the incident, Bob, but a general commentary on our social interactions in a uniquely Philippine cultural context. Same with Roselyn’s– it’s a larger picture of our worldview, nothing in purely black and white, but uniquely Philippine grey (or kayumanggi brown, if you will) that require sensitivity to recognize and understand.

              • roselyn please forgive me, but i am not putting words in your mouth they are your words, and everyone is entitled to there opinion, but i agree when in rome, do as the romans do, so i will stick my head under my butt, and hope to become invisible. Hope you have a wonderful new year.

  76. Edward: No hard feelings kept. You have a wonderful year as well. “Live Long and Prosper”
    (from Gene Rodenberry of Star Trek).

    • Rhodora- I appreciate that you understand what i was saying. Many people dont appreciate that not all cultures think the same way about things. They bring their pre-conceived notions with them from their own country, and then try to apply them here, and sometimes it is just not appropriate.

      btw – I dont think someone had to be somewhere to have an opinion on something

  77. I’m in my final year and any sort of communication during an exam is not on. If you breach any of the examination rules then you are to leave the exam no questions asked. That’s the way it’s always been and always will be.

    Furthermore, in the Philippines there is a hierarchical system and you do not challenge somebody that is high up in the hierarchy whether they are right or wrong. As a foreigner you have no rights and fighting for “your rights” is tantamount to challenging the Filipino way of thinking and as you say, that is a big no-no.

    Yes it sux but that’s the way it is there. Nothing is fair overthere if your a foreigner and you just gotta accept that. At the end of the day, you are just a guest there and if they want to be as obnoxious as they like then so be it. You cannot change that. If you dislike those practices so much then the place is not for you. “We’re not in kansas anymore”

    • Buddy, I appreciate that you are attempting to help, but having lived here for more than 12 years, I believe I am pretty savvy about the local culture.