Recently I wrote an article about the Balikbayan Privilege Program (which many of us call the BB Visa.. but it’s not a visa).
Does Everything Have To Be Controversial?
Many good comments were shared and different points of view expressed. I enjoyed it. There were (at last count) 88 comments, and the title, “Decide by Facts” didn’t even indicate the post was about Philippines visas.
It’s gratifying to see that many people were interested, and I appreciate every ‘read’ and most importantly every comment from every reader … I don’t do this for money … or fame. In fact it’s quite time-consuming to write “fact based” articles for me. (it is for anyone who wants to do it right)
I don’t publish unless I feel something needs to be said. And I know whatever I say, there will be many who agree and many who disagree. I really don’t care, if I think it should be said I say it. If you disagree, fine, that’s why we’re all made unique.
But what I don’t like to see is people making controversy out of thin air. I even have to wonder how many people actually bothered to read the article .. like the part where I said:
I want to be on record as NOT being “anti-permanent visa”, but I also hate to see the hurdles so many people put in the way for themselves in agonizing over it. It’s just one of several ways to stay here … and every one of them has advantages and disadvantages
Yesterday Bob emailed and went into a lot of detail in an email to me about how he didn’t want to start a controversy by writing and publishing his article about the 13 sereis permanent residency visa family. I consider Bob a very good friend and very much appreciate his concern and consideration … but there were times when I was reading his email I wanted to say, out loud, “Hey, no worries Bob, there just isn’t any controversy”.
My fellow author Paul Thompson, whom I also consider agood friend summed it up best with a comment from which I ‘stole” the title of this article:
No one person is right nor wrong, get the visa that floats your boat
Amen, brother. Couldn’t possibly say it any better myself, Thanks Paul.
Is There a Point To All This?
So, let’s see, Dave, you’ve used up more than 375 words here .. aren’t we ever going to get to some sort of controversy?
Oh, yeah, you’re right, dear reader. I’m known for creating controversy. Can’t possibly get through an article without it .. so here’s you issue for the day ..
Endless Discussion About Visas Is Bad For Your Health
It might lead to AIDS. Do be careful please.
AIDS!? Wow, what a shift of gears that is! Are you talking about the deadly serious Acquired Immunodeficiency Syndrome?
No, no, nothing like that. The Philippines, if you haven’t yet learned, is a land that just LOVES acronyms.
And in this instance I am tlkaing about the greatest obstacle to making you move to the Philippines and living here, happily in the Philippines, that you are ever likely to face:
As If Doing Something
For more than 10 years now I have been working with and attempting to help people interested in moving to the Philippines. I also work on a daily basis with a lot of people already living in the Philippines who have some issue with living here legally and comfortably.
Although people’s needs and questions are often very serious, the answers to those questions are sometimes simple, sometimes complex and they almost vary greatly from one person to another.
But I find that one common differentiation between the people who get their problems solved or find a solution that works for them … and the people who have been studying, questioning, debating, even arguing over the answer to their issue happens to be and never reach an end.
That the folks who succeed are not afflicted with the “Move to the Philippines’ form of AIDS.
Thee ones who never get anywhere keep themselves continually busy with researching, questioning, re-questioning and playing a continual online game of “what if” … all the while doing absolutely nothing toward what their rreal goal should be, perhaps:
- Developing a method to support themselves here
- Solving a legal problem they already know the have
- Picking a visa (whatever it may be) and then moving on to something more else useful.
And the list goes on and on, but I won’t bore you with it.
Stop Making It So Darn Hard
If you want to move here and live here successfully, just pick a visa and DO IT.
Or apply the KISS principle as I have often advocated before, and come here with out a visa and then decide what to do permanently after you have your feet on the ground. That will work fine too.
- None of the visas/privileges we have been talking about are all that difficult …
- None of them take all that long to get
- Every single one will serve the purpose in one way or another.
- No decision about a visa you make today is “irreversible”. You can always switch later.
It’s just not that complex an issue.
But what _IS_ irreversible is the time you waste arguing and “over thinking” the issue.
If you stop “stewing’ about the details and move forward with your plans, you’ll be glad you did … you can trust me on that.
Firstly, let me say, this comment is not meant to be confrontational, only to share my thoughts, and maybe spark a bit of conversation.
I don’t think that the Visa topic is controversial at all. I think that it sparks interest, because people simply want to learn more about visas and to decide which visa best fits their needs when they move here. Going further, I don’t feel that people “over think” it either, they just want to learn more and use that knowledge to make the best decision that they can.
Certainly, there are those who do sit and mull it over for years and years when they would be better to just get on a plane and go on with their life, but most people just spend an appropriate amount of time to educate themselves on the topic, make a decision and move on. Nothing wrong with that.
The main reason I will be getting a 13a visa is because I plan on attending college there. It is basically the same paperwork requirements for a 13a immigrant visa or 9f student visa. My wife is a dual citizen so why not just get the 13a. I am sure that it will come in handy on down the road. I can understand how someone who travels a lot comes in on a tourist visa. It makes more sense for them. Also if you are maintaining a residence somewhere else it might be more sensible for a balikbayan visa. If you are single you can put up some cash and come in on a SRRV. Different strokes for different folks, I believe there is a visa out there for everyone.
Bob/Dave;
Or take the “Paul” approach, after flying in and out on a tourist visa back in the early 90’s as I was still sailing them ships!, While I sitting in a gin mill, I casually asked which visa was the best way to go. Being the other imbibers were all in the same boat as me (Bing retired Military or Merchant Seaman, or like me:BOTH”)
Without a moments the words 13 series visa was shouted out and with no further thought or study that’s the way I went. But you, David and myself seem to agree that in the grand scheme of life it matters not a whit as long as you are in the Philippines legally. Put it to bed and let’s get on with the Living part of being here.
Every person who wants to make the move, has to contemplate what there own circumstances dictate, and itsgoing to be different for each person, so the generic answer of just keep it simple stupid, is not necessarily going to be the answer for everyone.
We have decided that we will be moving to the Philippines, hopefully by 2018, but for me, an awful lot of things must happen before that will be possible. For many, wanting to come there, money is a big consideration in making that decision, most especially if that person may have to continue earning an income once there, thankfully a job or money is not the problem we face.
If I worked for an employer and rented an apartment, the exit process for me would be quite simple, and if I had my way, we would be there this year, but I have a business that must be sold or more than likely liquidated, and that must be done in a particular order, and even though I have just recently started the process of listing some things for sale already, I am seeing its going to be quite a laborious choir. I have many vehicles and pieces of equipment that all have to be sold, and a fairly good size commercial woodworking shop, in fact I figure 90% of everything I own has to be disposed of, business and personnel, and all that takes time, its not a matter of just doing it, its a matter of finding many different people looking to buy, what I have for sale, and then agreeing on a price that we both can live with. In my mind it is quite a complex situation, because I will also be putting people out of work, in a time that some may have a hard time finding a new job, so I am also trying to talk to others I know,( my competition) seeing if they might be able to employ them.
A long time ago I posted a comment, and your reply was that planes fly in both directions, so if I dont like it there, I can always return, but I will have little to return to, if I did choose to do that, but after much thinking, I finally decided, that the only way to do this, was to sell everything and just plan on retiring hopefully there, or possibly here if I find I cant adjust to living there. I am lucky in that I have no living family left here in the US, so at least that part is easier for me. I am and never have been a person, that makes decisions without trying to look at things from as many different angles as I can think of, I make plans, thats just the way I am. Maybe I am the only one that makes this more complicated than it should be, I dont know.
For some its not as easy as just hopping on a plane and flying off to live in another country,I think some of us have to “stew” about the details and make some plans and then try to set the plans into motion, maybe I am also “over-thinking) things, but by not doing so, it could greatly affect out future if I just did things haphazardly.
The type of Visa, is not of all that much concern to me, especially after Bob answered my question last week and said I can come and stay on a Balikbayan or SRRV to begin with, and switch to a 13a after we quit traveling as much as we plan to in the first few years.
This website and others, have taught me a great deal of the things I feel I need to know and attempt to prepare for there, but I still have much more to learn, still.
Hi Bill; I guess I am the naive type because, I was like in as much I wanted to retire “someplace warm & wet: like a tropical isle. I went to Costa Rica, Mexico, Australia, New Zealand just to see if I would like it first. If not, I left. When I came here, I said, “dis is da place!” Then is when I figured out how stay & as all these other people have said, “it ain’t that hard.” Getting used to life here may be harder because these people don’t think like Americans. In Mexico it, “mañana”, here it is, “in a while.” But I live on Palawan, surrounded by many interesting “forengers” as we are called. Most of here are doing some “project” or other. That is the trick: stay busy; other wise like so many with nothing to do, where it is hot & the beer is cold, become a drunk. I have so many “irons in the fire” I haven’t got time for much else. So, come here, look around, find out where you think you would be happiest: on the shore, in the hills, in town or up country. Bill. [email protected]
Truer words never spoken, Bill.
To me the main things to insure a happy life here are:
1. Avoid controversy, especially politics.
2. Don’t be a news junky, glued to the tube 24-7. There will always be plenty going wrong in the world and very, very seldom is there ever anything we can do about it, so why stress over it?
3. Stay the hell away from cheap alcohol. In the 12 years now that I have watched fellow expats closely the number one reason for unhappiness, illness and even death has been excessive drinking. It sneaks up on many guys so slowly they never realize it.
4. Have projects. Work them. Keep at them. Boredom is not only a chief cause of alcoholism, it’s a prime contributor to depression. Stay busy, and if possible, find a project that makes you a few dollars. Keeps you young and alive.
5. And back to the original subject, use whatever visa that works for you, and don’t bother telling others what’s best for them.
Be well
I wouldn’t worry too much about controversy. I’ve found that folks who interact only with people who agree with them become rather shallow and narrow in their thinking.
One thing I find myself saying a lot when I’m working with novice horsemen (and women) is ” You’re thinking too much. Just do something.”
Take care,
Pete
BTW Dave, I got your e-mail. Very interesting points. I hope you got the several replies I sent.
Dave:
There is another phenomenon at play here, too… and not immediately obvious until you have been here a while. Just like the reality TV shows, “Storage Wars”, “Shipping Wars”, “Food Wars”… and umpteen other “Wars”.
“Expat Wars”
There are, quite frankly, a fairly decent sized subset of expats online who seem to like nothing better than to just be obnoxious know-it-alls. I wrote a number of articles about topics that I thought were rather benign… never expected a bunch of BS. You disagree with them? Ok… You are an idiot. But far beyond just name calling… People sometimes made veiled threats… over a disagreement… over something stupid like an opinion over whether to rent or buy a house, or what type of visa, or whether the sky is blue.
Bob even had some real wack jobs, like our old buddy Hill Roberts, who were crazy to the point of actually almost becoming stalkers. Or Corey, who made personal threats to attack Bob and his family over an article about renting a house!
I’m sure you’ve seen the sites online that were set up to attack other expats. Sure, some of them may be truly “bad” guys… But a lot of this stuff you read is no more that tsismis, at best. I don’t like someone? I’ll set up a website to slander them. It is amusing that it becomes an obsession with some of these people.Do they not have real lives to lead?
I just answered my rhetorical question… No, they do not.
That is the problem, and it is mostly with the retiree crowd, I’ve noticed. So many people come here to retire, and they get here, and they have absolutely nothing to do. I used to see the same thing down in Florida. There, it wasn’t web site (no Interwebby thingys then), but it was the people who had nothing better to do but go around to people’s yards with a ruler and measure how tall their grass had grown… and being sure to report these egregious violations. Or how someone parked their car. Ow what color someone was painting their house. Or constantly bitch to everyone within earshot about their pension, their insurance, social security, the Commies (at least in Florida), the President… ad nauseum.
That is why I am not so active on here any more. I got tired of hearing thr same old BS over and over again.
Bob should write his 13a article. The one I wrote five years ago, out of date now, still gets dozens of inquiries per month. If people don’t like it, they always have the option of not reading it. Controversial or not, people will still visit the site.
Wow. Just wow. A very nice word of caution to “future old farts”, John – and point taken. I saw this phenomenon with my own father, who was healthy as a horse and “fighting the good fight” – right up until he stumbled on some steps, hit his head and died at 77.
If there is one lesson I’ve learned this past year is that “life is too friggin’ short”, so find something to smile about and get on with living, keep moving forward and pick yourself up when you get knocked down. That’s why I’m here now and I know I’ll sort out my visa issues sooner or later when the time suites me.
In the meantime, I’m working outside on my new back porch in Tagaytay and watching the plants grow while listening to my girls upstairs giggling while they play. Oh, and I call my mom a couple times a week for good measure. 😉
Very true, Anton Faust. The only thing I would change about what you said us that I would day ‘people’s instead of retirees.
Am I the only one who can’t see Anton’s post?
Anton’s post, and the replies were posted on Facebook. The replies were auto imported from FB, but for some reason, Anton’s comment was not.
Lol – Maybe I’m the only one on the planet who frequents LiP but not FB (anymore – too much drama).
That was an honest and transparent read. I enjoyed it! Nicely done!
That’s true Anton… “grumpy old men” would not have a great time here. Or maybe by second thought: Some do love to complain about everything, a kind of sport. Well…come here – there’s new and different things to complain about 😀 To live here you need an open, tolerant and flexible mind/attitude!
Just as in buying a pair of shoes, there really is no ” one size fits all. It is the same with the rent or buy housing as well as which size visa will fit your requirements. Maybe we should feel fortunate that so many visa opportunities are available to us so there is nearly something for everybodys situation.
The way I see it, complainers need an audience to survive and thrive. You deprive them of an audience, they vegetate and die.
Hello all..:)
I asked on another thread about which visa would be appropriate for me coming there as a single man.
Bob answered me that a tourist visa or the SRRV were the only options I would have.
The SRRV is out as I will not have, and even if I did, would not want to tie up the needed funds to obtain that.
Am i correct in my assumption that I do not need to obtain the tourist visa BEFORE I arrive there?
And also, that it is good initially for 21 days with extensions for how long?
Could someone possibly give me a rundown of procedure for extensions of time frames, fees, how often I will need to leave the country?
If this particular issue is covered in another article please refer me to that if you would and forgive my redundancy of questions. I have not had the time to pursue all of the site yet and read all of the articles.
Great site btw Bob and thank you for all of your hard work here. I have obtained a great deal of valuable information here.
Thanks again for any help and information on this.
~~Richard
under 21 days was changed to under 30 for those traveling without a visa.
US Folks:
http://travel.state.gov/content/passports/english/country/philippines.html
Also look here for the Visa free travel countries of origin:
http://www.immigration.gov.ph/index.php/faqs/travel-req
item # 8 and 9 is what you looking for don’t get distracted by the 1-7 items.
also note: Brazilian and Israeli nationals are given fifty-nine (59) days visa free stay based on existing agreements.
excellent thank you..:)
Well said Anton.
Hi Dave
The good thing about this website is that the daily topics are open for discussion and I think it is the reason many of us include it in part of our daily routine.
Never underestimate how much the majority of us appreciate the articles written, whatever the topic.
In the words of Bobby McFerrin………….”Don’t worry, be happy!!”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-diB65scQU&feature=kp
While they may be many overly opinionated responders, understand that there are many of us who truly appreciate the informative nature of your articles. Much appreciated
Bill
I get it Dave Starr. Sometimes too much information is too much information. Thank you to both Dave and Bob for their articles on visas and balikbayan stamps. Very informative.